200ci Rebuild 65 200 I6 Block.

This applies only to 200ci
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echo1955

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FalconSedanDelivery":oeqhkjb1 said:
If you pick a cam that lopes , YOU WONT like the way it runs , unless you spring for the converter change .

Is there a converter out there I can buy and fit what I have:
If so what do I ask for and where can I get one:
 

echo1955

Well-known member
Thanks FalconSedanDelivery

Maybe a better way to phrase my question would be:

This is what I want to keep:
Stock trans:
Stock rear-end:
Add:
Al Heads:
Tri Carb Intake:
Moly Piston Rings:
Yella Terra Full Roller Rocker:
Dual Roller Timing Chain:
Dual Out Header:

This is what I want when finished:
Midrange 1000-4500rpm peak power
Mild rough idle
Premium gas if necessary:

Q: Is there a cam available to satisfy all of the above?
Now knowing I would need to change the converter. Not a problem..
 

JackFish

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Do you have a low-mount starter?
The high mount starter uses a variation of the C4 that has the ring gear welded on to the torque converter.
Not sure if what you're looking at would work.
Again, if you're using an automatic transmission you don't want a rough idle cam. They don't make enough vacuum, AFAIK. the 112° LC cam is recommended for an automatic for that very reason, and although it does have a bit of a lope below 1000rpm I can't say for sure that in my case it's due to the cam, and not something else. BTW I am running the 264/274/112° cam. You might look at the 268/274 from Classic Inlines, it's just one step up.
 

MPGmustang

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ClasicInlines":2v3ve79u said:
Isky Racing Cams - USA
Hydraulic Lifter Cams
248: 248/248 - 194/194 - .415/.415 - 109* - 1000-3800
256: 256/256 - 202/202 - .450/.450 - 112* - 1500-4800

the 256 is stock diration, BUT the lift is not! it's the desired lift, this should give more low end like your looking for, and your roller rockers should come in a 1.65 ratio makeing the power band come 500rpm sooner, so the 256 would look like

256: 256/256 - 202/202 - .495/.495 - 112* - 1000-4800

It's the only one I found with a 112* lobe center. should make plenty of vacuum!
 

MPGmustang

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echo1955":2rxo5d7g said:
I will let my grandson deal with the trans, rear-end disk breaks should he take the interest when his time comes..
He’s only 8 now..

I can be your grand son while u wait... :D
 

FalconSedanDelivery

Famous Member
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echo1955":2481fpt3 said:
FalconSedanDelivery":2481fpt3 said:
If you pick a cam that lopes , YOU WONT like the way it runs , unless you spring for the converter change .

I found this converter. Will it work.
http://racetransmissions.com/store/prod ... ts_id/1104
No , You have the converter that has the ring gear on it , some companies will CUSTOM build one , BUT it will be over 600.00, Stay mild with the cam and a112 at min lobe center , if you would build a 250 , then yes that converter would work
 

echo1955

Well-known member
JackFish":3457c60b said:
Do you have a low-mount starter?
The high mount starter uses a variation of the C4 that has the ring gear welded on to the torque converter.
Not sure if what you're looking at would work.
Again, if you're using an automatic transmission you don't want a rough idle cam. They don't make enough vacuum, AFAIK. the 112° LC cam is recommended for an automatic for that very reason, and although it does have a bit of a lope below 1000rpm I can't say for sure that in my case it's due to the cam, and not something else. BTW I am running the 264/274/112° cam. You might look at the 268/274 from Classic Inlines, it's just one step up.

The pix is w/o the 3 bolt starter (high mount?) but the torque converter starter ring is welded on
Engine_004.jpg
tqconverter.jpg


I plan to put in a new converter stall at 3300 to 3500 just in case.
I found the 268/274 here http://www.classicinlines.com/SelectCam.asp
And the 264/274/112° here http://www.classicinlines.com/CamCompare.asp
I will add both to my selection options.
Thank you…
 

echo1955

Well-known member
MPGmustang":2rzvw1r9 said:
ClasicInlines":2rzvw1r9 said:
Isky Racing Cams - USA
Hydraulic Lifter Cams
248: 248/248 - 194/194 - .415/.415 - 109* - 1000-3800
256: 256/256 - 202/202 - .450/.450 - 112* - 1500-4800

the 256 is stock diration, BUT the lift is not! it's the desired lift, this should give more low end like your looking for, and your roller rockers should come in a 1.65 ratio makeing the power band come 500rpm sooner, so the 256 would look like

256: 256/256 - 202/202 - .495/.495 - 112* - 1000-4800

It's the only one I found with a 112* lobe center. should make plenty of vacuum!

That is an Isky cam. I would rather use Clay Smith. He did all of our boat motors back in the 70's. Unbeatable work...
It looks as tho I will Have to stay with a 112* after all... It seams my converter sucks..
 

echo1955

Well-known member
FalconSedanDelivery":15cyjiop said:
echo1955":15cyjiop said:
FalconSedanDelivery":15cyjiop said:
If you pick a cam that lopes , YOU WONT like the way it runs , unless you spring for the converter change .

I found this converter. Will it work.
http://racetransmissions.com/store/prod ... ts_id/1104
No , You have the converter that has the ring gear on it , some companies will CUSTOM build one , BUT it will be over 600.00, Stay mild with the cam and a112 at min lobe center , if you would build a 250 , then yes that converter would work

Hey FalconSedanDelivery
if_02.gif
is one of the smallest words known to mankind:
BUT
It is the Biggest, Strongest most Powerful word ever used in any language.

You could put “IF’ in front of any major world event and IF applied would have changed global history:

As it applies to me...... :mrgreen:
if_02.gif
I had a 250…..
So now what.. Like someone remarked earlier... once you get started one thing leads to another...and so on... :unsure:

I think I will call tomorrow and see what the cost would be.. I could replace the whole trans if I had to… http://racetransmissions.com/store/prod ... ts_id/1066

By the way. .thank you for the eye catch. (y) Never thought the ring wasn’t a heat sink type..
O well stuff do happen hu…
 

echo1955

Well-known member
MPGmustang":3m108q87 said:
echo1955":3m108q87 said:
I will let my grandson deal with the trans, rear-end disk breaks should he take the interest when his time comes..
He’s only 8 now..

I can be your grand son while u wait... :D


hahahahahahah
yea you would...

uh ra uhhhh..say.......grand son iffen ya spring fer da aluminum head y ya could have a hundderd pocent say wid da cam c lection.....

:mrgreen: :mrgreen:
 

echo1955

Well-known member
I called Monster they cant help. I called DACCO and they can make a 3300 stall that will fit my C4 for 360 + tax.
This is my “”flywheel””
flywheel02.jpg


Now I’m thinking there is a good reason Monster does not build a high stall converter for this model.
I wonder if this “”flywheel”” will survive the torque my build will be capable of delivering to it?

My wife of 50 years ask me just the other day what the heck I was doing to the car. She has zero knowledge of anything mechanical.
She refers to 3/4 (three quarter) as 3 fourths. duhhh
I showed her a picture of jdn21758 3 carb build…

She looked at it and immediately said
“ that sure is pretty honey but I don’t think it will fit under the hood”” :unsure:

Now I’m wondering if I had her in at the beginning she wouldn’t have taken one look at the transmission and said..
“” gee honey that sure is pretty but I don’t think its big enough”” :mrgreen:

So I apologize to every one here for putting yall through the ringer with this cam business..

Back to square one.
 

bubba22349

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You could swap in a later model C4 and gain the better shifting valve body, and stronger input shaft too. It would be mostly a bolt in only real visible exterior change to car would be a 1967 or up shifter. Add a shift kit and could handle the mods you wanted to do.
 

echo1955

Well-known member
bubba22349":b65wkf1t said:
You could swap in a later model C4 and gain the better shifting valve body, and stronger input shaft too. It would be mostly a bolt in only real visible exterior change to car would be a 1967 or up shifter. Add a shift kit and could handle the mods you wanted to do.

Don’t look now but I think you have just revived me…..
Could you be more specific. What C4 would I be asking for from a latter model.
And what shifter kit would I ask for.

Remember I was not sharp enough to catch that flippen would be“”flywheel””
And I have actually changed the ring gear on 2 real flywheels.

You can not imagine how small I felt when I finally realized what I had for a flywheel…talk about depressed….duhhhhhh :shock:
 

FalconSedanDelivery

Famous Member
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Unfortunately , Changing the year of the trans WON"T help with the expensive converter deal , only if you had a late low mount 200 or a 250 would it get cheaper,the reg 144-200 use the same Converter / flexplate deal , the 70.5 models being the best C-4's but they to still use the same style as you already have
 

echo1955

Well-known member
FalconSedanDelivery":suqewx51 said:
Unfortunately , Changing the year of the trans WON"T help with the expensive converter deal , only if you had a late low mount 200 or a 250 would it get cheaper,the reg 144-200 use the same Converter / flexplate deal ,
the 70.5 models being the best C-4's but they to still use the same style as you already have

Would this one have a stronger internal design.

I can back off my original goal with adding torque. but if this 70.5 model is a stronger trans with additional shift benefits i could change latter on.
 

MPGmustang

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A stock C4 is not to be underestimated, V8's use the same C4 that the i6's carry and house 200hp and never give any problems. the only difference is the size of bell housing, and torque converter. your stock converter will cover any power increase mods that you add with not problems. the only downside is the stall rpm. I don't understand the complete mechanics of what the stall rpm does but I suspect it's a true 1:1 spin ratio, at a higher rpm.

your current C4 and converter will handle aything you throw at it. it won't hurt it. the only things you need to worry about is the proper vacuum signal and the converter we can help you find the right one. that is why it's suggested to stick with a 112 lobe center to keep as much vacuum as possible for ur stock C4.

I think your C4 will be perfectly capable of handling ANY naturally inspired mods you throw at it. and IMO I believe the stock converter to be fine withur choice of (264/274 112* .450)* cam.
*might be a little lumpy but should idle decently 650-800 rpm
 
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