All Small Six solid lifter alternatives

[customline]

I am currently amassing parts for a large bell 200 that I am building. It will have zero deck flat tops, a ported large log, etc. I am using a mechanical camshaft and earlier style adjustable rockers and pushrods from an earlier motor. I understand that an FE series solid lifter can be used. I have seen that there are "oil through" and non oil through style lifters. Does anyone know if the lifter is the same height as the original, does it matter which style I use (oil through), and does anyone have a good part number for this lifter ?
thanks - James

 

[Jmustang_65]

Oil through means they oil through the pushrods. The only roller rocker that require this for the 200/250 are the yella terra. FE lifters are the same size.

 

[aussie7mains]

Crow cams in Australia list lifters for the six and FE as the same part number AT282, they have a different PN (AT2000) for later crossflow engines and V8s. You could conclude from that, that early lift dont flow through, and later ones do. So for you you need the ball and cup pushrods and the AT282 lifters. However, if you want to save some coin, use a hydraulic cam. the log head 200 is NOT going to be a big rever, the log head wont allow that, so sticking with hydraulics will be sufficient for that. Solid cams generally will rev about 500rpm higher for any given duration. In any event I would not go above about 210 degrees duration @0.05

 

[drag-200stang]

You can still get 144-250 solid lifters, that way you can get just 12. You do not want oil through, unless you use the yella terra. rockers. Would not hurt to upgrade the pushrod, the stock ones are a little flimsy with more cam and stiffer springs.

 

[78_200_C4]

ENGINETECH MT872 $4.25 each

More Information for ENGINETECH MT872

 

[customline]

You can still get 144-250 solid lifters, that way you can get just 12. You do not want oil through, unless you use the yella terra. rockers. Would not hurt to upgrade the pushrod, the stock ones are a little flimsy with more cam and stiffer springs.

thanks, that clears up the oil through thing......

 

[customline]

ENGINETECH MT872 $4.25 each

More Information for ENGINETECH MT872

Thanks! just what I am looking for

 

[customline]

Oil through means they oil through the pushrods. The only roller rocker that require this for the 200 are the yella terra. FE lifters are the same size.

Thanks! that clears up the oil through thing

 

[fast64ranchero]

if you are worried about the flat cam issues that have been happening, Comp Cams sells lifters with an EDM hole to eliminate the issue but they are spendy...

 

[bubba22349]

There is another way to do this extra Cam Lobe Oiling (a good thing to do) that in OPIN is a much better way to do this. The Trouble as I see it with using any Hydraulic Lifter's with this EDM treatment is that this is just a controlled Oil Leak from inside the Lifter Piston area so this keeps the Lifter from ever reaching it's "Full Pumped Up Point" and thereby reduces their Max RPM potential, this wouldn't be an issue with the Solid Lifters though. Crane made a Tool that you can use to Groove the Lifter Bores from the Oil feed Hole down to the bottom of the Lifter Hole, works with any type Lifter to give you the extra Oil to the Cam Lobes. This Tool is the way I am going forward with all my current Flat Tappet Cam engine builds. The Crane Grooving Tool link is here. https://www.compcams.com/lifter-bore-grooving-kit-874-dia-std-ford-dia.html

 

[drag-200stang]

Here is my thinking on the grooving of the lifter bore, fine if the bores are tight and the lifter is on the large size but maybe not so good if the bores are worn oversized and the lifters are on the small size, leaking plenty of oil.

 

[Cox Custom Mechanical]

I've never had to groove a lifter bore, nor have I ever wiped a cam.

The main problem for camshaft issues is improper camshaft alignment, lifter bore geometry, run in procedure and some oils.

Short block.

• Hone lifter bores and ensure they are straight with a light crosshatch. Ensure they are not worn and polished from wear as it cause other issues.
• Measure lifter and bores, as like everything the tolerances vary.
• Ensure lifters are free to rotate in the bores and do not have any tight spots (if you follow the first 2 steps this is almost guaranteed)
• Clean off any assembly oil from the cam or lifters and ensure they lobes and lifter faces are clean of any oil. Do not skip this step oil will make the break in lube/moly lube slide straight off.
• Apply engine assembly lube to the bearing journals and break in/ moly lube to the lobes and lifter face.
• When you install the camshaft make sure that the lifter isn't centered on the lobe. Flat tappet cam lobes are not parallel, they have a taper so the lifter turns in the bore.

Valve Springs

• Ensure you only have about 100lb seat pressure for your run in, that normally means pulling the inner spring.

Run in

• Do not crank your engine to get oil pressure up before start up, otherwise you just wipe the cam lube off the face of the lifter before it has a chance to start the run in procedure.
• Run in the cam before anything else, don't play around with tuning the carb or timing just do the cam first, bring the revs up and follow the manufactures run in procedure.
• Drain your oil straight after run in while hot.
• Put correct valve springs setup for the cam in
• Double check your valve lash.

Once you have done all that, and as long as it was all assembled correctly, you can now do what ever you like and not have to worry about that flat tappet again.

 

[Angelking]

I've never had to groove a lifter bore, nor have I ever wiped a cam.

The main problem for camshaft issues is improper camshaft alignment, lifter bore geometry, run in procedure and some oils.

Short block.

• Hone lifter bores and ensure they are straight with a light crosshatch. Ensure they are not worn and polished from wear as it cause other issues.
• Measure lifter and bores, as like everything the tolerances vary.
• Ensure lifters are free to rotate in the bores and do not have any tight spots (if you follow the first 2 steps this is almost guaranteed)
• Clean off any assembly oil from the cam or lifters and ensure they lobes and lifter faces are clean of any oil. Do not skip this step oil will make the break in lube/moly lube slide straight off.
• Apply engine assembly lube to the bearing journals and break in/ moly lube to the lobes and lifter face.
• When you install the camshaft make sure that the lifter isn't centered on the lobe. Flat tappet cam lobes are not parallel, they have a taper so the lifter turns in the bore.

Valve Springs

• Ensure you only have about 100lb seat pressure for your run in, that normally means pulling the inner spring.

Run in

• Do not crank your engine to get oil pressure up before start up, otherwise you just wipe the cam lube off the face of the lifter before it has a chance to start the run in procedure.
• Run in the cam before anything else, don't play around with tuning the carb or timing just do the cam first, bring the revs up and follow the manufactures run in procedure.
• Drain your oil straight after run in while hot.
• Put correct valve springs setup for the cam in
• Double check your valve lash.

Once you have done all that, and as long as it was all assembled correctly, you can now do what ever you like and not have to worry about that flat tappet again.

You said ...."Do not crank your engine to get oil pressure up before start up" I have the distributor out at the moment. Would you still spin up the oil pump to ensure oil flow to the top of the engine?

 

[Cox Custom Mechanical]

You said ...."Do not crank your engine to get oil pressure up before start up" I have the distributor out at the moment. Would you still spin up the oil pump to ensure oil flow to the top of the engine?

Absolutely, I should have included that bit.

 

[drag-200stang]

X2
As far as cam installation, I now think that it is better to use engine oil on the lifter sides and bore and the cam lube on cam and lifter face. My thinking is thick lube on the lifter bore may not let the lifter turn easy which is imperative to proper cam break in.