Tuf Crossflow

[Anonymous]

HI,
I RECENTLY PURCHASED A TE CORTTY WITHOUT THE RUNNING GEAR. I WOULD LIKE TO SLOT A 250 XFLOW IN IT, BUT I WANNA BUILD A 13 SEC. ENGINE, USING A CARBY AND N/A.
COULD YOU GUYS PLEASE TELL ME WHAT SORT OF MODS/PARTS I CAN USE AND A PRICE-RANGE.
I WOULD LIKE TO USE A 4-SPD SINGLE RAIL GEARBOX.
THANKS...

 

[xctasy]

Use the alloy head XD,XE,XF, or XG engine. Buy an Ultraflow Sprint intake manifold, a 600 cfm Holley Vac Sec carb,some headers, and use the Cortina four-spped from the Cortina 6. The shifter from the Falcon 4-spd won't fit...it's 5 inches(127mm) too far forward. Then spend money on a recondition, run a Crow cam to there recomendations, and don't skimp on the hamonic balancer, flywheelm bolts, rod bolts, or rocker gear and pushrods. Stick to the 3.7:1 gears from the Cortina 4, and it'll do over 3300 rpm at 100 clicks, so I'd be looking for a 3.23: set of gears to fit, plus a good LSD unit. That will be best.

If you have a manual, it will wheel spin, and not win a bracket race. The 70-80 Falcon C4 is a bolt in, and it's my pick. Or a T5 with an XF Falcon bell housing and trans from a 5-speed EFI 4.1. Shifter will then foul the park break. My friend Richard uses the SR5 Toyota truck 5-speed, with close ratio gear set from a Celica. There are three positions for the shifter. The pickup one is best.

 

[addo]

13s N/A are going to be tough without nitrous... A good driver is part of the equation; a slim (= light!) person with good experience, reaction times and shifts will pick up a lot compared to an amateur. Will you be using the car as a daily?

Look for a virgin block. Everyone has ideas about which generation of alloy head is best. The engine build (just the motor) will be exxy - at least 3½G, more like 5½ by the time it's ready to slot in. For street use, you'll probably end up with a Holley 600 on a Redline manifold, all tidied and dyno'd. The ignition will need to be recurved and possibly an MSD will be of benefit... but may be just a waste of a few hundred.

The internals will be a matter of debate; I would tell you that the sum total effect may be reached by a variety of different methods. For the ultimate engine, time on the dyno and a few cams and other tweaks will be the way it goes.

The single rail better be in good nick. A worn one won't last under heavy loading. Stick with the BW diff (lighter) and choose your rear end gears carefully. Just some thoughts to begin with...

Cheers, Adam.

 

[Anonymous]

err
and quote
"The shifter from the Falcon 4-spd won't fit...it's 5 inches(127mm) too far forward."

i thought they where further back ???

just checking

cheers
pcman

 

[Anonymous]

THIS GUY I KNOW AT WORK IS SELLING A 250 XFLOW OUT OF HIS TD. HE SAYS HIS RUNNING A 500 HOLLEY, BIG CAM, ALLOY HEAD AND SO ON. I MIGHT END UP GETTING THAT, BUT I DONT THINK IT'LL RUN 13'S.....

 

[xctasy]

pcman said

err
and quote
"The shifter from the Falcon 4-spd won't fit...it's 5 inches(127mm) too far forward."

i thought they where further back ???

He's right. Wong direction.

 

[Anonymous]

HOW MUCH HORSEPOWER ROUGHLY WOULD THIS MAKE?

- port and polished alloy head
- Pacemaker extractors
- 3-inch exhaust
- Crow 14892 camshaft
- 500 Holley
- Redline manifold

 

[addo]

Cue >>>Deano!

Seriously, it will depend greatly on the things that don't come in boxes: Dialling in your carb and ignition. Remember that you should never trust a cam to be on the centreline alleged. Always set it up as per the cam card, with a Rollmaster or JP timing set.

Fitting Cleveland high ratio roller rockers will add some more power, but these are best found cheap at a swapmeet!

Adam.

 

[Anonymous]

I just realised Ive still got my old four cylinder TD Cortina diff. I assumed I couldnt use it when I put the six in the Cortina Because it looked smaller and flimsier than the Borg Warner and I thought the gear ratios would be way out.
What sort of cam would you recommend for this diff (I like Crow). Is there any value in it if I dont want to rev more than 5000 rpm. Might be a good way of getting some more get up and go.

 

[alloydave]

Tim , does the 4 cylinder diff out of the cortina bolt up in the same fashion ie :the torsion rods on the centre of diff up to the floor .If so i would seriously look at some strenghting of some sort .I had a mk3 2litre cortina with quite a worked engine and managed to pull the torsion mounts out of the floor on a couple of hard takeoffs and a few burnouts . Had to get the chassis cut and weld in a new section .A worked six would root it in next to no time.Apart from that the diff itself handled quite a bit of abuse.

cheers dave

 

[Anonymous]

yeah the 4cyl and 6cyl diffs use exactly the same mounts just a different ratio diff thats all
there however is a difference between all the cortiuna models the tc/td use a different shocker mount so custom shockers may be needed to put one into a te/tf the te 4 and 6 use the same diff different ratios the tf uses a smaller diff for the 4cyl unsure about the 6cyl

im currently runningn a tf 3.49(about that) in my te 6cyl manual and it gets up and goes at about 100kmph its doing about 2700 rpm thats with 15" rims without low profile tyres (195/65/15)

imm planning on dropping back to a 6cyl ratio 2.92 or 2.79 as i do aloty of highway driving and want better economy


anyway thats enough info

and yes ive ripped the mounts outta the chassi as well the easiest way to strengthen them is to get a sheet or 3-5mm steel 20x20cm and bolt it in the inside of the car through the mount im yet to do it to my car as its a pia to do but ittl happen eventually

cheers
pcman

 

[xctasy]

xflo said

HOW MUCH HORSEPOWER ROUGHLY WOULD THIS MAKE?

- port and polished alloy head
- Pacemaker extractors
- 3-inch exhaust
- Crow 14892 camshaft
- 500 Holley
- Redline manifold

My opinions, based on Kevin Bartlett, Dick Johnston, and an ex Ford development engineer.

220 HP, tops.
The rule is the 1.6 cfm at 1.5" of mercury pressure per horsepower.

So an 850 cfm =451 hp

a 750 cfm=469 hp

a 600 cfm=375 hp

a 465 cfm=291 hp

a 354cfm (called a '500' Holley)= 220 hp

a 248 cfm (called a '350' Holley)= 155 hp on a four cyl, but can be run to 175 hp fairly easily on a six

The so-called 500 cfm 2-bbl carb can only support 354 cfm in this engine. It's rated at 500 cfm at 3.0"of mercury pressure, unlike the 4-bbl carbs which are rated at 1.5" mercury.

DJR infered that the head flows 196 hp normally with a 280 degree cam. A 465 cfm 4-bbl Holley vac sec can support well over 280 hp easily, but a 600 cfm vac sec 4-bbl Holley is best. If you dampen the secondary circuit so there is a big flat spot, you can run on the primaries around town, and when the secondaries open up, it boggies like a couple doing the mambo. The fuel economy is best with the Holley 2-bbl 500. The bigger intakes for the 4-bbl loose low end torque.

Polishing the head is a bad idea, brake specific fuel consumption drops, and you only end up with an extra 2% peak power with an up to 10% loss in fuel ecconomy. Lesson learned from the V8 guys. Polish the exhast ports, but not the intake or combustion chamber. Port mismatch the intake manifold so the head is larger than the intake manifold. There is a huge improvement in low end tractability and better fuel economy with this mod. The exhast is too big. Go for a 2.5 inch pipe, with a 2.75 over the axle, back down to 2.5 at the back if you can package it. It's hard to make a Cortina pipe fit thats that big. You could even run a 2.5 inch pipe, and then the best 2.25 exhast tailpipe and muffler you could find. The best head is the pre-XF head without the kidney shaped chamber. Use the later XF vlaves in an XD/XE head, and you pick up extra flow with a small loss of swirl (mixture motion). The later heads need the correct ignition curve and compression ratio. When you start changing things, they are more suseptable to being correctly set up.

As A7M says, although its an Alloy head, don't go crazy on compression. I would if I could plumb a water injection system, but 99 out of 100 people don't want to use one. If you use a 12:1 compression ratio, and use a six port injection system, there is a massive improvement in part throttle economy to be had, plus better torque, and the ability to run on 91 ULP (Regular). You can run the optimal advance, with no major ignition changes.

DIFFS:
The Aussie TF runs a Borg Warner diff that is not a BorgWarner 78. It's the same co-op diff that the Aussie 1982 on wards RWD Toyota Corona's ran.

There are some really good ratios in the TF diff, but it is only a 6.5 to 7 inch diff, nothing strong about it. It was added because its ~ 20 kilos lighter than the BW 78.

The BorgWarner 78 =7.625" or 7.875" depending on the ratio, designed as a 200 mm diameter diff crown wheel, and called the 78 because its a 7 inch and 7/8 ths diff. It is bullet proof up to the 12 second level in six and V8 Cortinas.

GEARBOXES:
The TC's up till October 1972 ran a Type A or Type B diff, which was a British import. After the advent of the 200/250 sixes, Ford Ozzie rationalised the diffs to BW 78 on all models from 1972 to 1981. The TF is the odd man out.

In a similar way, the post 72 Cortina 4's in Austraila ran a BW gearbox which is the same as the Corona and VH Commodore 4-speed from those four cylinder cars.

TIM:

The BW 78 is the one to stick with. pcman is right on. Capris ran the Type B diff centre crown wheel and spider gears with some good optional Atlas LSD centres. 3.22, 3.09, 3.31. But they are rare as hens teeth. My TF V6 originaly ran a 3.45:1 Type B, and was a good diff, but a BW 78 is much better. It wasn't that easy to fit, because the Aussie ones ran pinned XAFalcon style shockies, not the eyed and bushed shockies the TC's came out with befre 1973.

HOT TIP:
The Toyota Hi Lux diff is a good swap, if you want a 28 spline LSD diff that can take a 10 second quarter bash. Just do the same mods George did in his 9" to TD swap...upper mounts and lower control arms, anti roll bar mounts, and shockie hangers. The brakes are humungas, and the wheels/hubs are 5 stud Falcon pattern. Gears are 4.88, 4.30, 4.1 down to 3.9:1. The stock Toymotor had staggerd shocks too, so you have to jig the diff to suit the Cortina stuff. Never use the axle shafts as a mig or arc welding source. Bearings get fried!

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the info?
Another one of yours for me to print and put in my folder (Im starting to get a big collection now)
I think my diff is ok its out of a TE and I just cut two brackets of it to fit it in to the TD. I was very surprized the first time I drove it to find that with the four speed it reved at 3000 at 110 kph. Especially when my AU was a bit over 1500 with the auto. Found it very hard to believe anyone would what to cruise at even higher revs.
To my dismay I discovered that the valves in my 2V head are about 3mm smaller than a 1.75 inch valve the American log heads have. cant understand what was the sence in fitting an Aussie 2V with these stupid things as standard. I think Ill end up taking the head off again and put these valves in plus get the bowls made bigger and find out if I can to anything else with the inlet to improve it.
Ive got a 2.5 inch exhaust. No one would fit it when I asked for it to be done and some said it couldnt be done. I has been done and it sounds great.
The only thing that is holding me back now is the cam. I bought the very last profile left at Camtech (getting no more for pre-cross sixes) I told them I wanted it to "go"and make power until at least 4600. They gave me one with fairly low lift only .420 and a 204 at 50 and 110 lobe sep 25/65 and they tell me its good for up to 4800. It is not, its only good for 4000 as I have found and any Crow cams spec sheet would say it is and many many others I have checked since.
Unfortunately I have fairly limmited funds at the moment with the wife expecting thats why I wanted to get it right the first time. Ill be a bit wiser on my coice of a supplier next time.

Thanks again best regards Tim

 

[xctasy]

I go overboard on detail because, in the past, I've allways been underdone in dollar$! It's cheaper to read bookes, and better birth control on long nights. Although I've got three children under the age of 12, so it didn't work that well...

Camtech need a rasberry for what they did with your cam! The 25/65 cam is an industry standard hop-up for 250 Falcons. COME, Speco Thomas, Wade, Jones, Crow, GRA all do similar kinds. There are very few people who hot up sixes with the cams they deserve because they either are governed by stupid 3-speed autos or log heads. You are the exception. If the Falcon XC/XD/XE/XF and Cortina TE/TF's got the old AOD, you could wack in a wild cam up to 280 degrees and never have a problem. Commodore V6 guys can. Few auto Falcons can take a 280 cam...they can't get out of there own way because of the huge 6.62:1 overall first gear thay have to pull. A Commodore has something like 9.42:1. So they can afford to loose the low end torque all cammed motors have to trade off for mid to high end power.

In a light car like a Cortina, you can cam it to crazy. A stock XC Falcon was 1483 kilos. A TE Cortina was 1220 kilos. Yours is even lighter!

The guides and valve lengths are different to the US stuff. Check all addos posts on 2V engines. The US vlaves had a different quality valve, but it was thicker and has a more restrictive profile. The Aussie ones were thinner, and had bronze guides, not cast iron, methinks. I'd get the US valves or a Aussie made stand in, and back cut the area above the valve to Aussie sizes. Perhaps, gasp, the early 308/253 valves? They are a similar height, and as long as the retainers and keepers fit, you will get some benifit. The 1.78 ich valve may suffer from shroading (lack of room for the fuel/air mix to flow easily into the chamber without turbulence) but any good head machinist would know what to do about it.