CR question

Gene 64 2dr

Well-known member
I was wondering if it would be worth the trouble of pulling the head off and milling it down to up the compression from around 8.3 to about 9.5.
I started out with a lower CR thinking of going with a blower at a later date. For now I’m keeping the tri-power setup.
My setup specs are below. Any input on a target CR?

Gene
 
Without doing the math, I would say you it would be tough to achieve that much increase by only milling the head, even if you change to a steel shim gasket, you may gain 1/2 or 3/4 point though. Its really a matter of cost/benefit.

The rule of thumb for compression ratio at these levels is somewhere around 4% HP increase per point of increase. If your current tuneup is yielding 150 horsepower, a one point increase would be worth around 6 horses. This is assuming that it runs well and does not detonate with the compression increase. If it does experience detonation and it is likely it will, you would have to retard ignition timing to a point that you would actually lose poser over the original compression ratio.

Being that these sixes are detonation prone, a better way to obtain a higher static compression ratio is to mill the block to obtain a zero deck height or better. This will help with the quench issue and allow you to run a better timing curve with less chance of detonation problems.

I know this is more academic than anything as it sounds like you have a pretty fresh build and it is not likely to be torn down to change, but just wanted to point it out for any other readers of the post. Cam timing can be changed in the car to give a better dynamic CR and may be worth experimenting with however. :beer:

Have you run a compression test?
 
Would you have to run higher octane fuel? Are willing to always pay extra for premium gas?
I tried to achieve a 9:1 CR with my build, but I had a steel gasket.
I want the option of using lower octane fuel, but then I'm not qualified to judge whether 9.5:1 requires the use higher octane gas.

I sent Mike at Classic Inlines a steel gasket that he said he wanted to use as a template for a run of them but I don't know if anything ever came of that.
 
Thanks for the reply.

No, I haven't done a compression test but I'll check it out soon. The snow is just about all gone and it's time to get back to work on the car.
I'm not planning on any tear down in the near future and it looks like milling the head would not be worth it.
I have another block to play with and I think I may start a new build with that. I can then switch the head over to that or better still go with the aluminum head.

Gene
 
On your next engine, "0" deck the block & mill the head down to 50-52cc's. That will give you about 9.5 compression.
On this engine milling the head will still reap benifits.
What is your cranking compression on this engine?? With a compression ratio in the 8.3 area you are leaving HP & torque on the table.
You need to get the cranking compression over 170# to make any kind of power.
Yes you will have to up the octane in the fuel, but if you want more power & driveability this is the way to go.
 
wsa111":31j49m8q said:
......With a compression ratio in the 8.3 area you are leaving HP & torque on the table.
You need to get the cranking compression over 170# to make any kind of power.
Yes you will have to up the octane in the fuel, but if you want more power & driveability this is the way to go.

The cost:benefit for compression ratio was discussed best by David Vizard on the detonation prone Pinto 2000 engine back in 1988. Basically, it's as wsa111 and First Fox say. A moderately risky 120 thou head plane on an early 170 head with 52 cc's takes it down to 35 cc or less; no problem going from 8.4:1 with a stock 59 cc head and 22 thou gasket on a 3.3 to 12.7:1. Cost is about 120 NZ bucks for me, or two 60 thou passes. Some of the Maverick 170's were still 52 cc right up till the early 70's in the larger port heads.


Commercially, only the 215 cube Olds Jetfire Turbo F85 ever ran an Anti Detonation Injection system, and it wasn't free from miss-use, or in-service failure. The Edlebrock Varatronic water injection could take water or a 50/50 water alcohol mix, allowing a 4 point compression ratio rise without the need for anything accept pump 87 AKI, even on a 1970-1974 Pinto 2000 engine. The 2-bbl carb and one 16 thou jet down the primary was all that's needed for a 100 hp 9.2:1 engine going to 125 hp and 13:1 or more, even with a short duration 264 degree sohc Pinto cam.

If because of freezing in winter you aren't able to safely use either straight water injection, or the other 50/50 mixes of methonal/ethonol with a few percent of acetone to make the liquid free from delivery system degradation, you'll have to use 93 AKI. You can run 9.5:1 with 87, you just have to pull down your basic mechanical Duraspark plate to lower total advance while still being able to raise base timing to the 12 to 16 degrees static our engines really like. You may have to change the degree of retard in the stock timing gear if base cold cranking compression is too high. The mixture of cold cranking compression and Duraspark advance curve define how you'll cope if 93 AKI wasn't around.

The EPA/CARB and the relevant FMV standards are anti 16.2:1 lean cruise air fuel ratios, and anti high compression due to the NOx propagation when CR's above 9:1 are used on two valve engines which don't put a lot of paddle wheel swirl on the intake air fuel mix. Even an iron block variant of the modern LS alloy Chev V8 puts 300 paddle wheel revs at maximum lift, and that allows them to run huge compression ratios without emissions problems. Our sixes, except the Classic Inlines alloy head, are pretty stagnant for intake mixture spin, and this results in an Inability to go sky high on CR.

The other option is to use the Classic Inlines head bolt size, a standard Cross Flow Aussie head bolt, and there is a special 1986-1992 OHV 3.3/4.1 version which takes a knock sensor which allows a Thick Film Ignition system to be run off an EEC IV or Megaquirt ignition controller, allowing knock retard. The Ford TFI, Duraspark II and III systems had this on some versions.
 
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