**UPDATED **Now where does this go again? **UPDATED**

[Anonymous]

Well heres a little story I just have to tell...

Today was the perfect day to work on a car. We had finnaly thawed out and the rain had stopped (it rains all the time here in seattle). With me engine already dead, and a rebuild project underway, I thought that I'd have some fun and tear my block apart and see exactly what went wrong. For those of you that have read my other posts you already know that two weeks ago my car mustang died on I-5 and when I pulled the valve cover off, two push rods were AWOL and the rest were seriously out of line. After a few hours and a few stuck head bolts, the 80 pound head was off. Everything looked fine to me, the clinder walls were shiny and smooth and no dings that I could see. So far so good. Now to crank her over and inspect the entire travel of the pistons. The number one piston... good. The number two piston good. But wait, what was that poking its ugly head over the top of the block in number three?! It was my oil shreadder and the TOP OF MY PISTON. I couldent believe it, so i reached for it. Slightly pulled on it, and the ENTIRE THING POPPED OUT!!!! AHHHHH!!!!!! I screamed as i saw the carnage with the number three housing.

http://public.fotki.com/goatbarron/must ... 00003.html

What had gone wrong?! Well my best guess is that the tie rod connector bolts failed on one said and threw part of it into the cam, chewing it up and killing my lifters and in turn eating my pushrods. The tie rod as you can see is throughly messed up. The cylinder housing is just as bad. There is about an Inch by inch gouge in the side of it and the crank has a pencil sized hole in it. All in all, I'd say Im lucky that i didnt send that piston though my hood, but wait, that would have given me an excuse to put a cowl induction hood on, darn.

Oh well, so now im gonna have to go out and purchase a new 200. So far Schucks has had the best price for a long block at 1160, and a short block for 690. The down side of this is that i wont be able to put the 264 cam in that i wanted with out alot of extra money. oh well. I guess Ill just make do with a stock 200 for now.

 

[Anonymous]

Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear......

well hope u enjoy your next rebuild project. (a good thing to do each time u rebuild that engine is make it more powerful should be a real record breaker in a few years )

 

[Anonymous]

actually that engine cant be rebuilt due to that inch gouge in the cylindar housing. so im getting a whole new engine. the bad part is though i dont have the skills to put a cam in by myself so id have to pay for a shop to do it and i dont have that kinda cash lying around, so ill end up with a stock six engine for now. i might put a set of headers on but i dont really have the money for much more as the cost of a whole engine will be more.

 

[Anonymous]

well i'm sure that if u ask around on the forum u could get pretty specific instructions as u go through the cam change step by step. It actually doesnt require real mechanical skills, just a good set of step by steps for someone whose never done it...any manual will give u the basics of replacing the cam, if u get stuck, just ask around, it'll get sorted out.

 

[CobraSix]

Yeah, Cam replacement is easy, especially if the engine is out of the car. If you have the engine out, it's the best $200 you can spend on your engine performance. It'll reallyl wake it up.

Also, not being anal, but isn't that a Connecting Rod? Tie rods are for your steering set up.

Slade

 

[falcon fanatic]

Is the head still good? You might want to buy just the short block @ $690, slip in a new cam and bolt on your old head (after a three angle valve job and milling). The price would be about even with a stock long block and it would definetly have more pep. Like the others said, it's pretty easy if you do some reading first. Of course, it would void the warranty on your new engine...

By the way, have you talked to these vendors about options? You might actually have a choice of camshafts and heads.

 

[rbohm]

8) do yourself a favor and get the shortblock. if you have the extra cash, pay the core charge and keep your block as the cylinder can be saved by sleeving it.

 

[trashline]

these directions are straight out of the chiltons1964- 73 mustang manual

1. remove the cylinder head
2. remove the cylinder front cover, timing chain and sprockets
3. discount and remove the grill ( you dont need to do sicne the motor is out)
4. using a magent remove the valve lifters and keep them in order so that they can be installed in thier original positions
5. remove the camshaft thrust plate and remove the camshaft by pulling it from the front of the engine. use care not to damage the camshaft lobes or journals while removing the cam from the engine.

install
6. before installing the camshaft coat the lobes with lubriplate and coat the journals and all the valve parts with heavy oil
7. reverse the above procedure for installation following the recommended torque settings and tightening sequences

 

[Falcon62]

The only thing I'd add to the Chilton's procedure is to use the cam maker's supplied or recommended lube on the lobes or you'll void the warranty. Lubriplate (a white lithium grease) is inadequate for lobe protection on a new cam. If lube is not supplied or specified, use a quality assembly lube designed for cam lobes. Failure to do so could lead to very early cam failure.

 

[Anonymous]

i looked into this some. i was suprised kragen auto had about the best prices in my area on rebuilds. the tech line at the rebuilder is 1-800-81RECON
company is Recon. i was surprised there 68 rebuild comes with hardened valve seats. Frankie

 

[MandarinaRacing]

4. using a magent remove the valve lifters and keep them in order so that they can be installed in thier original positions

I've yet to see someone pull this off, it's virtually impossible Best way is to put the engine on a stand and flip it upside down....or...the way I did it, I had to push them out from below, with the block still in the car....now that was a treat!!!! :roll:

Alex

 

[x21]

Hardened valve seats? really? I had the 200cid in my 68 replaced with a recon rebuilt motor done in late 2000. Its a 66 head on a 78 block.
How'd you find out about the heads having hardened valve seats? Would that have included my engine as well? Or was that an option in ordering?

 

[Anonymous]

Wow, didnt know cam replacement was that easy, I just might do that....
I figured out the cost of the short block and it would be about the same cost to me as just doing the long block. To resurface the head and do a 3 angle cut and to harden the valve seats would be about 400 from a local shop. And yeah, I was surprised too, Schucks (karagen and checkers counter part) has had the best prices so far. And the schucks that i got my quote from used spartan as their rebuilder. But that could be unique to this region.

Just one more question, when replacing the cam, you have to remove the lifters, when replacing them, how do you know which way to put them in, since they are hydraulic lifters dont the rollers on them have to be put in a certain way?

 

[trashline]

couple things... that info was straight out of a manual so what problems you have had while replacing cams has nothng to do with it. second i was just trying to give the guy an idea since nobody else could give him step by step directions. and third i imagine that when you pull the lifter out pay attention to which direction the lifter was and put the new ones in the same way. so goat barron when i replace the cam in my new motor in about three weeks i will tell you how it all worked out according to the manual. i would pay attention to which lobe grease and heavy oil you use bc i know that can effect the performance of a cam. if you happen to change the cam before then send me a pm.

 

[Anonymous]

Yeah I will. I wont be even getting my new long block till after April 10th, that when I get paid again Then a week for shipping, so I'm looking at around April 18th-19th for the install and start up, I hope.

 

[I66coupe]

It was probably that pencil sized hole in the crank that started the whole problem. Check the crank in the new engine. If there are any holes in it, have the shop weld them up or you might be looking at the same trouble later.

Be sure not the use V8 tie rods in your new engine, they use a different fluid. Top off the blinker lube, use a new muffler belt (cheap insurance) and you're good to go.

 

[Falcon62]

There is about an Inch by inch gouge in the side of it and the crank has a pencil sized hole in it.

It was probably that pencil sized hole in the crank that started the whole problem. Check the crank in the new engine. If there are any holes in it, have the shop weld them up or you might be looking at the same trouble later.

Just so there's no confusion, if you're talking about the pencil sized holes I'm thinking of, they're supposed to be there. They are the oil feed holes for the main and rod bearings.

The holes are actually smaller than a pencil and there shoud be at least one on every main and rod journal, two on some. You can confirm this by sticking a thin piece of steel rod through the journal. For example, on my 4-main 200, #1 main has one hole and feeds #1 rod journal which also has one hole, #2 main has two holes and feeds #2 and #3 rod journals which each have one hole, #3 main has two holes and feeds #4 and #5 rod journals which each have one hole, and #4 main has one hole and feeds #6 rod journal which has also has one hole.

If you were to weld these up, there would be no way for oil to get to the bearings and things would come to an abrupt halt. If the hole you are referring to is rough and jagged, then it's not an oil hole. The oil holes are precision drilled during crank machining.

EDIT - Ok, I just read the rest of Rande's post and realized he was being facetious. Regardless, what I posted holds true for Goatbarron!

 

[I66coupe]

Yes, please understand I was kidding.

 

[Anonymous]

No, the oil hole is still there. This hole is one that definately shouldent be there. It looks really gruesome in there. The hole has these little teeth comming outta it and small cracks and its all scored up. Definately not a good thing.

Ya know, I66coupe, I have had such a long and tiring week, finals week for me and state basketball playoffs, and i just started a new job that I read what you wrote and was like ok that all sounds good but what the h%&$ is a muffler belt? Is it like a new mod that you use or something. I just realized that you were giving me flack. Dont play with chris' head, with my engine dead and all the stress of driving a PURPLE FORD TAURUS is getting to me All i want is my baby back. Oh well some day.

Just a quick question to run by you guys, i think i already know the answer but i want your opinion,

The day before this happend I had my oil changed at our local wallmart, I know its wall mart but i have been extremely busy and have had the time to do it my self. Luckly I was in the shop when they started it up, and it made a screaching sound, after about a 40 seconds of this I yelled at them to shut it off. I found out they had only put in 3 quarts of oil!! So i told them at least 4 and a half and they started it up and it seemed to run fine. The next day the engine blew. Any possiable relation and do you think that if i take it to wall mart i might get them to pay for a rebuilt engine?[/quote]

 

[Falcon62]

Cool another Washingtonian!

Well Chris, I'm not one to rag on people who drive purple Ford Taurii (my daily driver is a light blue Taurus wagon).

Now, as to Wal-Mart being responsible for your engine failure - maybe. Please bear with me as I haven't read your other posts. How many miles were on the engine prior to melt down? Did it get hotter than normal? Did you continue to drive it even though things didn't seem right? Did you get the knuckle draggers at Wal-Mart to document they ran your car with less than a full crankcase?

The reason I ask is the burden of proof rests upon you. If you can prove they caused your engine to self destruct, they owe you a new one. You have at least one thing in your favor, they fired it up with less than a full crankcase, the engine made abnormal noises on startup, they continued to let it run for about 40 secs, and 24 hours later it died. At the very least you might get them to admit partial liability and pay a portion of your rebuild costs. I'd only play that ace if it appears they aren't going to pay for replacement.

If you really want to build your case, take the block, crank, busted rod and piston to a reputable machine shop and ask them to diagnose the failure. Let them tell you what they think first, then tell them what happened at Wal-mart. Ask them if what happened caused or contributed to the end result.

After visiting the machine shop, it's time to visit Wal-Mart, and talk to the service dept manager, tell him what happened when they changed the oil, tell him you think it caused bearing failure, which blew your engine. If the machine shop says oil starvation caused engine failure, then tell the manager about it. Be firm - you have nothing to lose!

Oh, and our razzing is lighthearted, please don't take it serious. After the week you've had, you need to be able to step away and relax a bit. One of my supervisors from year's back had a great saying whenever I'd be stressing over something at work. He'd tell me, "Don't sweat the small s**t Phil, it's all small s**t." You know what? He was right!

Smile Chris. 8)