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Gear drive for a 200

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64 200 ranchero
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Gear drive for a 200

Post #1 by 64 200 ranchero » Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:29 am

Has anyone been able to adapt something to make a gear drive timing set for a 200?
60 ford ranchero daily driver. 200 tri power, modified c4 trans, ds2 distributor, msd programable 6al2, weber ict's, 8" rear end with full spool, 3.40 gears, 245 tires, CI dual out header, Dynomax muffler, 114hp shot wet nitrous kit. JE Forged pistons, 280 110lc cam, around 11-1 compression.

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woodbutcher
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #2 by woodbutcher » Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:35 pm

:hmmm: Hi Ranchero.Not that I know of.However,there are performance companies out there
that have a company motto that goes like this."If you got the money honey,WE got the time".All it takes is "Cubic Dollars".
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo
"People never lie so much as after a hunt,during a war,or before an election".
Otto von Bismarck

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chad
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timing gear v chain

Post #3 by chad » Thu Dec 21, 2017 4:29 pm

X off on x-mass vacation? Hand that 1 off to him!

gear drive? U mean like on the 300 / 4.9?
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), 250, NV 3550 & DSII to B transplanted, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #4 by CNC-Dude » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:24 am

Just keep in mind that creating a gear drive set-up for an engine that originally is chain driven introduces some challenges that you may not have considered yet, one is that it makes the cam reverse rotation, and a special cam will have to be ground to compensate. It also will make the distributor turn backwards unless the drive gear on the cam is machined in reverse to restore the original direction or a custom distributor gear is made to compensate for it. So it can end up being a costly modification above and beyond the price of the gear drive timing set.
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #5 by rbohm » Fri Dec 22, 2017 11:34 am

cnc-dude is right if you are talking about a 300 big six style gear drive. the problem there is that the small six timing cover isnt large enough to use that style drive as the gears are too far apart.

adding a third gear is a possibility, that maintains the standard rotation cam and distributor, but it also has the problem of the timing cover not being large enough to handle the extra gear.
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #6 by RichCreations » Sat Dec 23, 2017 12:51 am

rbohm wrote:cnc-dude is right if you are talking about a 300 big six style gear drive. the problem there is that the small six timing cover isnt large enough to use that style drive as the gears are too far apart.

adding a third gear is a possibility, that maintains the standard rotation cam and distributor, but it also has the problem of the timing cover not being large enough to handle the extra gear.

Well, you could shrink the 2 gears that are there to make room for the idler, just saying...

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64 200 ranchero
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #7 by 64 200 ranchero » Sat Dec 23, 2017 10:41 pm

I was thinking about the same type of style that a V8 would use, but I can see how the cover is too small for an easy setup. Maybe if I modified the cover, hmmmm...
60 ford ranchero daily driver. 200 tri power, modified c4 trans, ds2 distributor, msd programable 6al2, weber ict's, 8" rear end with full spool, 3.40 gears, 245 tires, CI dual out header, Dynomax muffler, 114hp shot wet nitrous kit. JE Forged pistons, 280 110lc cam, around 11-1 compression.

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #8 by CNC-Dude » Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:31 am

You might begin with a justification of why this is a viable swap for your needs. Given the custom fit aspect of it, does your build warrant such an upgrade to a gear drive, and with all the extra costs involved to buy the gears set and possible fab costs to make them fit. Do you end up being better with a gear drive over a double roller chain setup. Gear drives drain HP, on a certain dirt track engine we saw a 40 HP loss from switching to a gear drive over a timing chain in a SBC engine, with all other components in the engine being identical. On engines such as these inlines that don't make a lot of power anyway compared to others, is the power loss worth the switch.
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64 200 ranchero
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #9 by 64 200 ranchero » Sun Dec 24, 2017 12:25 pm

I was not aware of the power loss, I'll just stick with what I have in that case.
60 ford ranchero daily driver. 200 tri power, modified c4 trans, ds2 distributor, msd programable 6al2, weber ict's, 8" rear end with full spool, 3.40 gears, 245 tires, CI dual out header, Dynomax muffler, 114hp shot wet nitrous kit. JE Forged pistons, 280 110lc cam, around 11-1 compression.

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #10 by drag-200stang » Sun Dec 24, 2017 1:03 pm

CNC-Dude wrote:You might begin with a justification of why this is a viable swap for your needs. Given the custom fit aspect of it, does your build warrant such an upgrade to a gear drive, and with all the extra costs involved to buy the gears set and possible fab costs to make them fit. Do you end up being better with a gear drive over a double roller chain setup. Gear drives drain HP, on a certain dirt track engine we saw a 40 HP loss from switching to a gear drive over a timing chain in a SBC engine, with all other components in the engine being identical. On engines such as these inlines that don't make a lot of power anyway compared to others, is the power loss worth the switch.

X2 :thumbup: I have not had any problem with the oem drive and I abuse It.The 250 has some drive issues but the 200 is fine ,just use good parts.
66 Mustang Coupe
200 turbo w/lenco 4-spd
stock adj. rockers, stock timing set, ARP studs
best 1/4 mile ET 9.85/best mph 139 on 8 lbs progressing to 15 lbs boost
Went 9's when 10's was fast.

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64 200 ranchero
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #11 by 64 200 ranchero » Sun Dec 24, 2017 10:45 pm

I have abused my double roller quite a bit, I just don't like the looseness of it, I swear that the stock chain was a bit tighter. I just don't want to skip a tooth. I know that there is some degree of slack, but mine seems excessive. I just bought a new double roller chain, let's see if it was just worn out. I'll take some pictures when I have the chain cover off again.
60 ford ranchero daily driver. 200 tri power, modified c4 trans, ds2 distributor, msd programable 6al2, weber ict's, 8" rear end with full spool, 3.40 gears, 245 tires, CI dual out header, Dynomax muffler, 114hp shot wet nitrous kit. JE Forged pistons, 280 110lc cam, around 11-1 compression.

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #12 by Econoline » Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:03 pm

Are you saying that the dbl roller had some slack when it was new and first installed?
It ain't gonna fix itself

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64 200 ranchero
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #13 by 64 200 ranchero » Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:31 pm

It did, but it wasn't as much as it is now. I recently had some engine problems. My car backfired and shut off while I was on the freeway, after I had it towed home, I checked the timing chain to see if it jumped a tooth, the sprockets were still at the timing that I set it to, but the chain was very loose. My problem turned out to be a blown freeze plug at the intake. I decided to tear the engine down and I found that the rockers ate away at 2 of my valve's stems, I did a compression test and found that one of my cylinders were lower than the others, 5 were about 150 and one was at 110. I removed the head and found that I had some major scoring in one cylinder and I have never been satisfied with my oil pressure at higher rpms, so I'm building a new short block. Now that I have the engine taken apart, I'm looking to get rid of any weak links. I'm currently using a 90 shot of nitrous and I might go up to a 120 shot, this thing needs to be able to take a good beating.
60 ford ranchero daily driver. 200 tri power, modified c4 trans, ds2 distributor, msd programable 6al2, weber ict's, 8" rear end with full spool, 3.40 gears, 245 tires, CI dual out header, Dynomax muffler, 114hp shot wet nitrous kit. JE Forged pistons, 280 110lc cam, around 11-1 compression.

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64 200 ranchero
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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #14 by 64 200 ranchero » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:41 am

Check out echo1955's video mustang build III, I had a similar experience with the double roller, but I still used it.
60 ford ranchero daily driver. 200 tri power, modified c4 trans, ds2 distributor, msd programable 6al2, weber ict's, 8" rear end with full spool, 3.40 gears, 245 tires, CI dual out header, Dynomax muffler, 114hp shot wet nitrous kit. JE Forged pistons, 280 110lc cam, around 11-1 compression.

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #15 by chad » Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:52 am

64 200 ranchero wrote:Check out echo1955's video mustang build III...


Good ol RP. Excellent procedure, fantastic camera & edit techniques. Thousands of "clicks"
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), 250, NV 3550 & DSII to B transplanted, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #16 by 65coupei6 » Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:54 am

64 200 ranchero wrote:Has anyone been able to adapt something to make a gear drive timing set for a 200?


Yes. Back in the day, a guy named Mike made some. Not Mike, AzCoupe, but a guy in Sonoma, CA
CI was supposed to sell them but there was some kind of falling out.

They did sound good!
...Marco

'65 Mustang Inline 200. VI (CI) Aluminum Head, Holley 350, Schneider 264/274 cam,
Headers, DSII, MSD 6A, and a whole lotta other stuff!

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #17 by drag-200stang » Mon Dec 25, 2017 11:58 am

64 200 ranchero wrote:I have abused my double roller quite a bit, I just don't like the looseness of it, I swear that the stock chain was a bit tighter. I just don't want to skip a tooth. I know that there is some degree of slack, but mine seems excessive. I just bought a new double roller chain, let's see if it was just worn out. I'll take some pictures when I have the chain cover off again.

I do not use a roller, I use stock oem name brand.
66 Mustang Coupe
200 turbo w/lenco 4-spd
stock adj. rockers, stock timing set, ARP studs
best 1/4 mile ET 9.85/best mph 139 on 8 lbs progressing to 15 lbs boost
Went 9's when 10's was fast.

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #18 by drag-200stang » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:11 pm

I believe a double groove crank damper will help chain life over a single.
66 Mustang Coupe
200 turbo w/lenco 4-spd
stock adj. rockers, stock timing set, ARP studs
best 1/4 mile ET 9.85/best mph 139 on 8 lbs progressing to 15 lbs boost
Went 9's when 10's was fast.

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Re: Gear drive for a 200

Post #19 by Does10s » Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:22 am

65coupei6 wrote:
64 200 ranchero wrote:Has anyone been able to adapt something to make a gear drive timing set for a 200?


Yes. Back in the day, a guy named Mike made some. Not Mike, AzCoupe, but a guy in Sonoma, CA
CI was supposed to sell them but there was some kind of falling out.

They did sound good!


I can confirm that AZCoupe did have a geardrive setup installed in his '67 Mustang! That was the nastiest sounding 200 I have ever heard! With the hood closed, you'd swear it was a supercharged small block!

Later,
Will
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'86 Mustang, Turbocharged, Best ET: 10.70@132.
'69 Mustang Sportsroof, 351w, auto
'63 Falcon, Turbocharged 250, C4, 9", Best ET: 10.64@127mph 11/21/14

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