New Project Car

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8)

For the '69 road car we need to know what rules and mods are allowed. Some classes require single carb, no chassis mods and no brake mods, etc.

So first we need to decide what class we are building for and then build with that in mind.
 
Suspension is easy for a track car.

To start. Go with a airbag setup up front. I really like the new setups. In the rear go with a watts link. Then of course subrame connectors, roller idler arm, drop it an inch, etc...
 
Mike

Tell Rich to contact Bill Hickok @ Hickok Race Cars in California City, Ca. I believe Rich knows him. I know Will and Kelly do from the race circuits. Bill did my '62 Ranchero when I lived out there. He is one of the best. His shop is at the California City Airport and number is 760-677-9078. He is usually at the shop on Sunday afternoon. It is just him and one helper. This is fun stuff to him. He won't do you wrong. He can build anything you want for a chassis, from just a roll bar to a full tubular chassis with a funny car cage. He also fabs rear ends, and custom headers. He builds everything for YOUR car. Many of the top cars out west have been built or modified by him. He has many customers in many race classes that are tops in their field. Again a good guy who will do you right.

Darrell
 
Here's the rules for Vintage Racing.

1. ADVERTISING: If carried, must be neat in appearance. Members' cars shall display IVRA decals. Period specific advertising is encouraged. Some organirations set a sq. inch limitation on advertising.

2. BATTERIES: Must be securely installed. Batteries mounted in cockpits must be covered. Battery terminals must be covered.

3 BOOY: Bodywork must conform to SCCA GCRs for 1973, except for historic cars. Automobiles must be prepared to exhibit a clean & neat appearance with all bodywork intact and painted. IVRA intends to present racing vehicles in basic origina1 condition or with modifications, equipment and options that are consistent with and were available according to the vintage of each car.

4. BRAKES: Dual master cylinders and braided steel lines are recommended. Original type discs/drums are to be used. Size and shoe/pad material of your choice. Vehicles must have at least one working brake light. Formula cars are exempt but must carry a functional rain/fog rear light.

5. CATCH TANKS: Securely mounted and a minimum of one quart capacity each for engine oil and radiator overflow.

6. DIFFERENTIALS: Original housing must be used. Ratios and limited slip by owner's choice.

7. ELECTRICAL CUTOFFS: All cars must have an externally mounted master cut-off switch permanently mounted & clearly marked with electrical symbol. This switch must be in an area easily reached by the corner workers.

8. ENGINE/TRANSMISSION: Must be original type as specified in the SCCA Production Car Specifications. With the exception of Formula Fords, original specifications regarding displacement, carbs and horsepower may be changed so long as the performance technology was available when the car was in production. Increased engine displacement must be declared on entry applications.

9. EXHAUST SYSTEM: No restrictions except must exit toward rear or side of car and behind driver. Please note that some tracks have a 93 db maximum noise rule which would require the use of a muffler.

10. FIRE PROTECTION: All cars must carry a dry chemical fire extinquisher of at least two pound capacity rated lA-lOBC or better. Must be mounted within drivers reach. On board fire suppression systems are highly recommended for all sports racing and formula cars. IVRA recommends on board units for all cars.

11. FIREWALLS: Except for certain formula cars, a complete firewall is required between cockpit, engine and fuel tank areas. Holes larger than 3/8 inch diameter are not allowed.

12. FUEL CELLS: Mandatory for all formula & sports racing cars and recommended for al I other cars. Fuel filler caps must be securely fastened in order to prevent opening on impact. Monza style fuel filler caps must be safety wired or pinned shut.

13. MIRRORS: Sufficiently deployed to afford unobstructed view to rear of vehicle.

14. NUMBERS: Racing numbers will be permanently assigned on a first come first served basis. All cars must display their numbers, minimum 10 inches high, 1 inch stroke, on front and sides. Class designatiom minimum 4 inches high, are required on both sides of car following assigned numbers. Adequate contrast between numbers and background must be maintained in order to be legible to timing and scoring officials ffrom either side of track.

15. ROLLOVER PROTECTION: Roll bars are mandatory for all racing vehicles. Roll cages are recommended for open cars. Pre-war historic vehicles will be reviewed individually under this requirement. SCCA roll bar specifications have been adopted by IVRA. Roll bars must be higher than the drivers head (with helmet on) when seated in the car.

16. SAFETY BELTS/HARNESSES: 5 or 6 point harness with 3 inch lap belts required in all cars. 2 inch minimum shoulder and submarine straps also required. This assembly must be secured to body and frame with adequate reinforcement plates. Belts and harnesses attached only to seat or seat frame will not be accepted. Arm restraints are required in open cars, formula cars and cars with sunroofs. Window nets may be substituted in closed cars.

17. SUSPENSION/STEERING: Original attachment points must be used. No excessive wear allowed. Periodic crack testing is recommended.

18. THROTTLE SPRINGS: At least two external throttle springs are required on throttle linkage.

19. TIRES/WHEELS:
a) The use of any wheels of the same diameter and with a rim no more than 1.5 inches wider than the original production wheel is allowed. Changes in track resulting from the above wheels may not exceed plus or minus 2 inches from the track dimensions listed by the SCCA for the specific automobile. Wheel spacers may be used within the above dimensional restrictions. The use of center-lock wheels and hubs is permitted within this track restriction.

b) Formula Cars, Sports Racers and Prototypes wheel type and size must comply with what was originally authorized for the type of car by either FIA or SCCA.

c) Tires must be free of visible defects. (cracked sidewalls are considered visible defects). Any minimum series 60 DOT approved tires with a tread depth of a minimum of 1/16 inch must be used by all production and sports cars. The speed rating of the tire must match the capabilities of the specific car. The tires may.not intefere with the bodywork.

d) Formula Cars, Sports Racers, Prototypes and selected exhibition cars may use racing slicks which are in good condition and free of any visible defects.

e) Changes in wheel width and tire size shal not cause tire to interfere with the bodywork under any conditions of steering lock or rebound. In order to provide clearance for the wheels and tires the the interior fender panels may be altered but not removed. The exterior contours of the fenders may be altered only to provide for tire clearance. The fender opening may be ''radiused''. Fender flares, if used, may extend a maximum of two(2) inches from the original body.

f) The tire tread may not extend beyond the fender opening at the highest point of the tire.

20. SPOILERS:
a- The fitting of a spoiler to the front of the car is allowed for cars manufactured after 1968, provided that no changes are made in the bodywork for this purpose and that it does not extend to the side beyond the centerline of the front wheels nor more than three (3) inches below the lowest part of the original and stock front body panel. The spoiler may not pass above a horirontal plane passing through the wheel center hublines nor may it extend forward beyond the most forward part of the front body panel.

b. Pre 1968 cars will be allowed a spoiler which extends no more than one 1) inch below the lowest part of the original stock front body panel and follows all the other guidelines listed above in "a". NOTE: Other vintage organizations do not allow the use af spoilers.

21. TECH INSPECTION: A complete tech/safety inspection will be performed on each car at least once each year. Any technical infractions must be corrected before the next event. Severe technical infractions may require repair before vehicle is allowed on the track.

22. UNDERTRAYS: Cars equipped with undertrays must provide adequate drains or holes to avoid trapping fluids.

23. WINDSCREENS: May be removed and replaced with a "Brooklands" type screen or other at owners discretion. Head lamps, if used, must be taped.

24. GLASS: All glass except windshields in closed production cars may be replaced with plexiglass.

25. SEATS: Seats shall be securely fastened.

26. TOWING: An eyebolt or equivalent shall be provided for towing. On open cars, the rollbar will suffice.


Racing cars approved by other vintage race organizations will be accepted at IVRA events provided that appropriate entry fees are paid and drivers are duly licensed and are in good standing within their parent club.

Members are cautioned that some eligibility standards within IVRA may not be accepted by other vintage racing organizations. You are advised that should vou choose to compete in other venues, your car should be prepared to meet the appropriate rules of the vintage organirations presiding over those events.

The only items I'm questioning are:

carbs and horsepower may be changed so long as the performance technology was available when the car was in production

1) Can I use the new aluminum head? The OZ250-2V was introduced in 1970, but were aluminum heads being used back then?

2) Can I use a turbo? I would guess no problem.

3) Can I use the TBI's I put on the SEMA motor? Was port injection around back then, and if so, what type of controlers would be allowed?
 
The "technology" was there for alloy heads - no worries (remember the alloy slants). Corvair turbos greatly predate '69 - no worries either. Sounds as though you may have to utilise mechanical injection, though (think Triumph GT6)... Or go with triple IDFs on a fabricated manifold. That would be very visual, and downdraught Webers are well proven on Porsches.

Rule 17 seems to rule out Shelbification, and Rule 19 is a bit sucky. The tin hat diff may need external bracing unless you can claim that an 8" was "original" in the sense of being available on '69 Mustangs.

You know what? I would dummy up a valve cover that looked like it was DOHC. That would snag so many looks! :twisted:
 
Rule 17 should not be a problem if the old holes are cleaned up well. At least it wouldn't be a problem until you smoke the right person then they will cry foul. :lol:

The tech was there for aluminum but not for our six. We need to find out if it applies to specific engines or a broad spectrum.

I think some of the SBF cars are running Edelbrock heads but Vic is a sponsor. :? This might be something that can be voted in.

Technicaly you can't run a DUI dist but you can run a vertex mag.

Was a 250 available in 69 or are we going to have to add a couple of headlights?

#8 Can we run a t5? We need the extra gear.
 
Mike, go drag racing, the BS that you have to contend with to road race is kosher for safety, but the rules seem to be against you.

Just my opinion, if a vintage race was in my area i would not waste my time to attend.

Plus if you wreck, tough darts.

You won't wreck on an 1/8 & 1/4 mile track.

Drag it. The sky is the limit & a hell of a lot cheaper.
 
If you did go to a vintage race you might be supprised.
I felt the same untill I went to my first SCCA race and I was in awe at some of the cars. There was a Foyt Camaro, it was awesome to see this piece of history doing laps.

On the other hand you will get limited exposure because the club races don't have many spectators. Most of your exposure will be from mag write ups and pulling it on an open trailer to car shows.

I have searched SCCA and they don't realy have a clear cut class for it.
Most of the classes are based on the A Sedan class and it specifies V8.
If there is a Trans Am class it might allow it. These classes don't say max engine size they say 302 with max overbore not to exceed..... Not every SCCA region has a strong Vintage group and the SCCA doesn't really push it.

The HSR might fit you into one of their classes.
http://www.hsrrace.com/HSR/HSRHome.nsf/ ... penElement

The VARA is based close to you.
http://www.hsrrace.com/

Considering the all the fuss over Linc's project you will see a quicker return on your investment with your drag project. That project apealed to the average Joe because it was obtainable.
 
Check and see if you can more or less duplicate the road racing setup of the 302 BOSS mustang. That will give you a known starting point for suspension work etc. If you can and you can run the aluminum head you might have a very good road racing car. I doubt they will let you run a turbo but side draft webers were definitly around at that time. A well geared four speed with a high reving six should be more than adequate for race use but will be one gear too short for comfortable hiway cruising.
 
8)

The Vintage rules do sound a bit restrictive.

It sounds like a T5 would not be allowed, shame since the options are rather limited. Hmmm...Toploader 4 speed 250 I6?

Instead of mechanical fuel injection could go blow through carb setup using a Holley 350cfm 2bbl and a carb bonnet, those have been around for almost forever.

Might also be able to go with a supercharger. Studebaker Avanti's were supercharged in the early 60's.

Would be a heck of alot cheaper than a mechanical injection setup.

It says you have to use original disc/drum setup. You could get the drums drilled...
http://www.chtopping.com/CustomRod4/

Would really be nostalgic.
 
I spent a couple of hours reading rules last night and some of the groups say original number of gears. One of the rulebooks said an overdrive was considered a four speed + overdrive and was OK. I just don't remember which one it was. The others state T10.
 
I'm not to familiar with the road race stuff,But my thinking would be more towards a vintage look but setup more for Open track events as the rules for theese events might be more open and allow use of newer style products and they seem to get quite a bit of coverage in most Magazines.Mike solo racing or time runs might be an option too.Everyones input is welcome and encouraged thanks rich,
 
I would suggest a hot street/road car with a quick change rear end; allowing gear changes for Hwy cruising/long trips.

Air bags front and back.

Does Hotchkiss make suspension compenents for your car?

Do something different or novel with the exhaust. Maybe a chambered pipe 'ala the 69 Camaro. Something different.

Engiene oil cooler w/ integral elec. fan.

Great break upgrades.

Somehow actually integrate the shaker hood w/ the induction.

Visually impactfull maniofold/carb set up. Make a very visual statement that this is a piece of mechanical machinery (not elctro-mobile).

Be able to drive it to the road course; no trailer queen.
 
Just my 2 cents worth but more people would be impressed if it could be driven on the street, if it can do well on all tracks 1/4 mile and road coarse, and then be driven home you'll have a winner! no matter what you do I think you should take advantage of the extra 50 cubes you get with the 250, the 250 also opens up trannies, as it use's the V-8 bell, have fun what ever you deside Sept. will be here quick
 
I'm not sure about the suspension yet, but for the power plant and drive train, how about a 250ci stroked block with a lightened crank, triple TBIs, and a turbo, backed up with a T5 and 355 or 380 gears? For exhaust, something radical, like a custom 3 1/2" single out header. That should round out a killer six nicely. :twisted:

Oh ya, I almost forgot the best part. I just got word that I will have an aluminum head in time for the engine build, which we plan to assemble the weekend of Aug 26th. BTY, the timing couldn't be better, my b-day is the 30th. Couldn't get much better than that. :wink:

:beer: :beer: :beer:
 
WOW :shock: What class? :shock: Which organization? :shock:

This will be fun. I am suffering from vintage envy :lol:

I wish you much luck and a happy early birthday. I think you should treat yourself to a birthday present and get your license so you can make some laps. Even if you don't feel you will be competetive you will enjoy making some laps with your toy. You deserve it. :beer:
 
Mike,
First of all, great job in continuing to promote the inline ferver. I think either direction for the car (drag or road) would be wonderful!

My input to the discussion is to try to find a way to use 4-lug suspension....a Stainless Steel or Master Power front disc brake setup and a Currie Enterprises built Alumi-8 8" diff...

There are tons of 4-lug Mustangs out there and an article like this might prompt manufacturers to consider producing more wheel options to fit our rides.
 
IIRC if you use a 9" rear with a aluminum carrier it weighs less than a 8.8" rear.

On the other hand a 8" rear requires less energy to turn.

The setup lsited above sounds pretty wicked and should suprise alot of people.
 
The car is already five lug with an 8" out back. The previous owner planned on dropping in a 302, but fortunately, gave up on it. :wink:

Mustang Plus is donating the suspension bits, so there is no telling what I'll get. They have quite a few different kits. I think they are going to pop for disc brakes, a T5, the rear pumkin, subframe connectors, clutch assembly, roll bar, and a few other bits and pieces. Not sure at this point as Jim Smart is setting it all up.

The car, obviously, is being sponsored by Classic Inlines and Mustang Plus in a joint venture. I'm going to try to make it up to their show this fall, so they can get a peak at it. The owners are great guys and I had excellent service from them when I built the 67 coupe, so this should be fun doing a car with them. I've wanted to do something like this for a few years, and somehow it all just fell into place within a weeks time. :D

Here's a few more pics of the car. It's going to need some work, but overall, looks to be in pretty good shape. If I can line up a body shop to help with the paint, I'd like to go with a chrome yellow. Otherwise, its going to remain orange. I'll be picking it up as soon as I get back from the Falcon Nationals. Humm.... wonder what it will look like four weeks later?? :shock:

BTW, I'm going to need a killer logo too, to paint on the sides. Anyone here with graphics skills, that's wants to contriibute, drop me an e-mail or PM. I've already got some ideas, but open to suggestions.





 
Uh-Oh,I see a clutch pedal,it's Tremac-Time :o ! Orrrr......you could use my Doug-Nash 5-Speed'r,and is that an 8-Track Player I see under the dash? Time to break out the Buddy Miles(the 'Live' edtion in particular...)/Donnie Osmond/Jimmi Hendrix(Rainbow Bridge)/POCO 'cartridges :lol: .' Oh,Yeah. I also got that same Grant wheel in a box someware. Aftermarket wheels are the 'ultimate-freebie',I've had quite a few(still do...)lay'n around. The car looks fab Rich,by the way :wink: . -OO6.
 
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