Radiator & Cooling Fan Options

[thesameguy]

I need to create about a 1/2" to 3/4" gap between my cooling fan and crank pulley on my '62 Falcon. As it is now, however, the cooling fan has virtually no clearance between the radiator so I've got nowhere to move it to. I'm currently using an ancient (4 blade?) fan, but have a newer (6 blade?) fan as well. The newer fan just makes things worse, as it's even closer to the crank pulley.

The previous owner of the car told me he'd put a radiator from a Mustang in, and I'm wondering if maybe it's thicker than a stock Falcon radiator? Would switching to a Falcon radiator help? Are there other options (aluminum, maybe?) that would create additional clearance?

I've got about 1 1/4" between the face of the water pump pulley and the radiator, which is much too tight for any electric fan I've seen, and unfortunately I've got a transmission cooler in front of the radiator which prevents using a pusher fan.

This isn't a critical item right now, but I'm trying to line up some options. Any suggestions are welcome!

 

[bubba22349]

A simple spacer will fix the fan to crank pulley clearance problem. Can you post a few pictures of the radiator and it's mounts? That's we're I'm thinking the problem is!

 

[thesameguy]

I can't use a spacer because there isn't enough clearance between the fan and radiator to accommodate that. If I space the fan out 1/4", it's going to make bestest new friends with the radiator.

Unfortunately there is nothing in the engine bay right now, but I can take pictures of the radiator and whatever else that would be helpful. What are you trying to see?

 

[bubba22349]

The side mounts of rad and how much clearance is between rad and the front header. If its the wrong year to fit your body that could be the problem not letting the rad move more to the front. I have a 64 falcon rad here that can take a few measurements from if it would help you.

 

[thesameguy]

Ah. The "ears" for my current radiator are at the leading edge of the core, so the radiator is fully in the engine compartment, maybe even 1/8" or a 1/4" back from the front cross member into the engine bay. The end tanks are a bit thicker than the core, and more or less rest against the cross members. In order to move my existing radiator forward, I'd need slimmer end tanks.

If you could post a picture (maybe a side view?) of your '64 radiator that would be helpful. I can post a picture of mine for comparison in a little bit.

 

[bubba22349]

OK will try to post them tomorrow

 

[oldgrezmonke]

Let me be sure we understand fully here ; is your fan both too close to the radiator and too close to the crankshaft pulley ?

 

[thesameguy]

Sort of, yes. It fits fine as-is. However, I need to space the fan out from the pulley to create room for an ignition trigger wheel. I don't have the room to do that, so I'm looking for suggestions on:

1. A thinner radiator
2. A thinner fan blade
3. A thin electric fan
4. Some combination of these items



I know people around here have used electric fans, but I'm not joking when I say I have no room for one. I have an inch or so between the water pump pulley and radiator, which is not enough room for an electric fan. I can only guess that people are using thinner radiators to create that space, which makes me wonder if the "Mustang radiator" installed by the previous owner might be thicker than a correct Falcon radiator.

 

[oldgrezmonke]

O.K. , that extra information helps . Here are some ideas to check .
First , I have read somewhere about the motor mounts that the wrong ones or on the wrong side can cause the engine to be moved forward . The motor mount design changed in '62 so take a look at a vendor catalog like Mac's which gives the changeover date and pictures to see if you have the right mounts . If I read correctly the engine is out so it should be easy to measure to see if swapping sides might move the engine back , even 1/4" would help , right ? .
Second , AFAIK , the Mustangs used the same basic radiator design as the Falcon [presuming the PO didn't fit in who knows what] . However there can be differences caused by the number of rows in the radiator . How many rows in the one you have now ? The difference between a 2 row and 3 row can be 5/8"-3/4" so that is something to consider . I recently had to replace my radiator . The old radiator was a 2 row . I replaced it with the least expensive radiator I could find which was a 3 row . The 3 row was 5/8" thicker effectively cutting the fan clearance in half with the original fan . I found a fan that fit better but like yours it got closer to the crank pulley . I am talking of the copper radiators ; I have no knowledge about the aluminum ones .
To wrap up , I'd check the mounts first as that would cost little or nothing compared to replacing the radiator .

 

[thesameguy]

The mounts are right for the motor/year - I actually replaced them late last year, and saw what you were talking about. I suppose I could oval out the holes and move the motor back a little, but that would put the transmission right up on the tunnel.

I think the radiator is the key. I'm betting the previous owner did what you did and got the less expensive of the two radiators, which would be the thicker 3-row. It's installed using the original bolt locations, so I'm fairly confident it's at least correct for the body. Any chance you still have your original 2-row and can measure it's thickness? I like having the larger radiator for Sacramento summers, but I'm willing to sacrifice it!

 

[oldgrezmonke]

I live in the Mid-South , hot and humid , and I had no trouble with engine temperature till the old , somewhat plugged up , radiator sprung a leak [and took the head gasket with it] , had even been in a couple parades . Of course my engine is close to stock . At worst you might want to add one of the water wetter products designed to help cooling . Here are some pics and measurements . The first shows the side of the frame - 1 5/8" , the second shows the offset to the core - 1/8" . That puts the old core surface at 1 1/2" from the mounting surface . The new radiator [Spectra CU 1463 EDIT - I cannot recommend this product , it became a problem for me] is 2 3/16" at the frame , 2 1/8" at the core surface .
http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/9183/dscf0006j.jpg
http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/5398/dscf0008w.jpg

 

[thesameguy]

That is fantastic - thank you! I'll see how that compares to mine this evening. I'd kind of like to go ahead and replace my radiator anyway - its was not carefully installed and has had two transmission coolers zip tied to it. Plenty of fins are bent and it looks a little messy as a result.

 

[oldgrezmonke]

No trans cooler in the radiator ? Must be really old . My new one had one but I can't figure how to hook it up ......

.....to my 3ott .

 

[thesameguy]

The original radiator had one, but when the previous owner swapped radiators he didn't get one with provisions for an automatic transmission. He had some horrible cooler installed which I replaced last year with a much nicer one, but it's still external. I'm okay with this, as it means dinking with one system doesn't impact the other. Plus, I always have it in the back of my head the radiator could fail internally and lead to cross-contamination. Speaking from experience, coolant in an automatic transmission will ruin it pretty quickly.

 

[bubba22349]

Here are some pictures of the Falcon Rad setting on the front header panel parts that had left over from a 64 Sprint maybe it will show how close it would be when mounted. You can click on them to enlarge view, hope it helps you. Good luck

 

[thesameguy]

Mine looks similar at the header panel, but visually looks quite a bit thicker, so it would project deeper into the engine bay.

I've got a core thickness of 2" and an end tank thickness of 3 3/8", so it looks like I'm talking about somewhere between 1/4" and 1/2" by switching to a two row radiator. That would probably get me what I need, so I've got that to fall back on.

I appreciate all the info - as soon as I get the trigger wheel installed and the engine back in the car, I'll post back with what the solution is!

Edit: I am tempted to give one of these a try:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/FORD-FALCON-60- ... bc&vxp=mtr

The core is 1 1/4" thick, and being all-aluminum should out-cool a brass radiator. Anyone ever heard of or used this brand? They also have a 1 3/4" thick core, but that doesn't do much to address my issue.

 

[woodbutcher]

Hi TSG.If your rad is a copper/brass like oldgreazemonkey posted,here is a little trick that I picked up working for a friend who owned a radiator shop before he retired for health reasons.Go to a good rad shop and have the mounts removed and switched side for side.
In other words put the left mount on the right ,and the right on the left.That will put the mount holes at the rear of the radiator,and the front of the radiator farther to the front of the car.Thus gaining at least,what,2 1/2 inches of space or more.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

 

[bubba22349]

This one is a V8 (289) is two rows the side straps are 1 5/8 and core is about 1 3/8. Have not heard anything about that brand of Alum Rad but they don't all cool as good as a Brass / Copper one. In an Alum rad you want to have two rows of tubes that are 1 inch.

 

[thesameguy]

Yeah, I am concerned about its build just for that reason. I have a terrible aluminum radiator on my XR4Ti that was built using the wrong type of core (air, not water) - it does the job, but managing the temperature is extremely difficult and the results inconsistent. Learned me a good lesson on that one.

 

[Frankenstang]

I've been running a fleabay 'Silla' radiator around 4-5yrs now....very happy with it. It's hard to beat copper in cooling efficiency, but I can attest to the aluminum Silla beating the socks off a worn out one Like most parts, built overseas...but quality seems good. I've heard good things about the Champion brand alum as well.

So are the round bodies that much shorter on clearance, or is this a later model 200 with the slightly longer nosed water pump My '66 has a 'think' ~1.5" spacer which will allow me to convert to a stubby clutch fan combo from a jag that the big-block FE guys run...so not a ton of extra space...but it doesn't sound like you have much of a spacer on yours. Good luck