Won't Start!!!!

[WornTired]

Well the subject sums it up, heres the story behind it. Its an 83 200 in a '64 falcon. It has the alt, and duraspark put in it. Recently we were having vacuum troubles w/ the carb and rather than replacing it I upgraded to the 2v. Now, it doesn't even come close to starting. The carb is getting fuel, and the spark plugs a spark. There is fuel collecting when you look down the carb. The rpms speed up when I spray starting fluid into it, but otherwise it just turns over and over. Any one have any expert advice? This is one blowing my dad and my minds. We can't seem to figure anything out.

David

P.S. The plugs were new before we put the carb on, they are black now, but I cleaned them up.

 

[rbohm]

8) you need 3 things to make an engine run;
1: spark at the right time.
2: the right amount of fuel and air.
3: enough compression.
it sounds like to me you have too much fuel, and perhaps not enough spark. check the fuel mix first as that is most likely your problem.

 

[WornTired]

We set the timing. There are two jets in the side of the carb, both were all the way in. I took each one out two notches. This is on the 32/36 weber. Compression seems ok, but no sure way to tell. how do you go about adjusting air/fuel? I tried w/ the butterfly open and closed and everything in between.

 

[rbohm]

8) there are idle mixture screws that you use to set the idle mix. on the weber many people make the mistake of turning the screws out 1 1/2 turns after a rebuild. they should be 3/4 turn out max. if you have to go more than that you need to richen up the idle jet. but it sounds like you are flooding the engine with fuel which means too much fuel pressure. for the weber you should have about 2psi, 3psi max. otherwise you blow the needle off the seat. a test for that is to use a flooded engine start procedure. hold the throttle wide open as you crank the engine over, and keep it open when it starts to clear out the excess fuel. if it starts then, then you have too much pressure or other problem causeing flooding.

 

[WornTired]

Alright, tried the previous method and still no running car. It did want to start a bit more, but its acting like it isn't getting enough air, not sure what to think on this one. Any more ideas? Thanks,
David

 

[Anonymous]

Just guessing, but maybe your fuel inlet needle is missing.

 

[WornTired]

its getting fuel. I guess you're talking about the hose taht comes from the fuel pump right?
david

 

[Anonymous]

We set the timing.

WornTired,
How did you set the timing if the engine wont start? Have you had it running at all since you installed the duraspark dizzy? Did you do anything with the distributor cap and wires? I'm thinking you may be 180 degrees out with the cap. Try moving the number one spark plug wire to the opposite side of the cap and then follow the firing order on the log for the rest of them.

 

[WornTired]

There is a marking for the number one cylinder on the cap. From there we just went around. I guess we didn't really set the timing, just found TDC and went a few degrees advance, 5 maybe. We had it running before switching carbs, there was just a bad vacuum leak in our carb. I'll try your idea though, I'm pretty much open to anything at this point.
David

 

[XFlow_Fairlane]

did you try to pinch the fuel line shut and try starting it? I know the pressure for a 1100 is much lower then my holley and it would flood real bad and not start unless I pinched the fuel hose. can you see fuel coming out of the carb with the engine not cranking? it might puddle on the throttle plate and spurt up when the throttle is opened.

nick

 

[WornTired]

I'll try that and see what happens. The fuel pump is off the original one in the falcon, the big can looking one. Would that make much of a difference, or should one for the year on there?
David

 

[WornTired]

I am having absolutely no advances in my project. I've tried everything that I thought it might be, and some things that I didn't think were wrong. Still nothing. Maybe someone with the same combos can help me. Its a:

83 200
Duraspark
Clifford Adapter
Stovebolt 2v
New fuel filter/pump/starter/battery/plugs/wires

Is there something I am missing? Please help, shes been sitting almost 18 months now and all I have left is this carb problem. Thanks

 

[Asa]

first time finding this post for some reason, i found a few things that you might check/try...

1)you said:

There is a marking for the number one cylinder on the cap. From there we just went around

i know that it's almost a common sense thing, but did you check the firing order?

2)with the duraspark, did you install that? if so it might be possible that you got one tooth off which would throw the timing off, to check timing you need to get a timing light, you crank the engine to TDC, make a mark on the harmonic balancer at 0 degrees with something you'll be able to see (white-out works well), then hook the clip to the #1 plug wire and try to crank the engine, you should be able to see the mark somewhere close to the degree indicator, from there rotate the cap till it is set correctly (if that sounds confusing then check the instructions that come with the light, or in a manual)

3)fuel pressure was mentioned, you said when you tried the flooded engine starting method that it wanted to start a bit more, well one thing to try is that you could go to autozoo and get an electric fuel pump and regulator and dial the pressure down to approx 2-2.5psi, then try to start the engine, if it is a fuel pressure problem, then that might solve it

4)lastly, unless i'm mistaken, the fuel inlet needle is part of one of the valves inside the carb, if you are missing it, then a rebuild kit should have a new one

good luck, don't lose heart, you'll get it running soon
evan

c'mon guys, someone one here prolly has some better ideas than me, let's here them

 

[WornTired]

Did all of that short of the electric fuel pump. I did slow the pressure down though by pinching it to no avail. Thanks though

 

[Anonymous]

sounds like you need to adjust the carb, mixture because if the plugs were black then to much fuel before you gain enough RPM and vacume to burn it fast enough.

 

[Anonymous]

do you have a pressure regulator with that 5200, post from a bit ago (http://fordsix.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=20999&highlight=#20999) says the stock pump puts out too much fuel pressure and can blow the needle off

 

[Anonymous]

IIRC Weber Carbeurettors require 6lbs of fuel pressure. You may want to investigate into a fuel pressure regulator.

 

[Anonymous]

Define "won't start" - is it cranking? Does it want to start and then sputter and die? Is the starter turning over and you just never get any life?

What about your choke? I had a car that wanted to just turn over and over and it was because the choke was all screwed up. Try having someone start the car while you adjust the position of the choke and see if that makes a difference...

 

[WornTired]

The starter turns the engine, the engine just doesn't want to go. It sounds pretty close to what you get when you forget to connect the dist. But all the cylinders are getting spark, and plent of it. I'll get regulator and try that to see what happens.
David

 

[MustangSix]

Distributor 180 degrees out? There are two TDC's; Once on compression, once on exhaust. Fire the igniition on the wrong stroke and it won't run.