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t5 swap 66 mustang 200

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Mach1Mark
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t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #1 by Mach1Mark » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:05 am

I posted this in the transmission swap section, but thought is might get more reception in this area...Quick question, i hope has a simple answer. I have an opportunity to purchase a T5 out of a 95 mustang GT.... Will it bolt up to my 66 200 block. I will need an adapter plate and I have the bell housing off a [manual] 3 speed 6cyl trans . however I'm under the impression that I need a new, or different input shaft? are these easily obtainable, and easy to replace. Or should I just continue to look for a 93 and older trans. Thanks for your help

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #2 by bubba22349 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:29 am

Some of the info you might need in IDing your bell housing and flywheel combo plus which of the T 5 adapter plates available can maybe found in the above post on small block six differences see below link. I don't know that there is a difference on the input shaft lengths until 1997 and after but I could be wrong. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:

Block and Bell Housing Differences
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=80022
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #3 by Mach1Mark » Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:42 am

yes, I read all that info, unfortunately it was quite confusing to me. I spoke to MDL some time ago and did look at the web site, and the way I understood, an early 3 speed bell with adapter (from MDL of course) would fit from like 82 up to 93, but read further is some of these post,..that I would need a new input shaft for 94 and 95 T5. Just wanted some clarification. Thanks for Ur and help, maybe others will chime in.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #4 by StarDiero75 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:03 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:yes, I read all that info, unfortunately it was quite confusing to me. I spoke to MDL some time ago and did look at the web site, and the way I understood, an early 3 speed bell with adapter (from MDL of course) would fit from like 82 up to 93, but read further is some of these post,..that I would need a new input shaft for 94 and 95 T5. Just wanted some clarification. Thanks for Ur and help, maybe others will chime in.

I think you're right on the longer input shaft for the 94,95. The input shafts should be available online and I'm sure there are videos on YouTube for swapping the input shafts. There are plenty of T5 videos on there.

On your bell, some 66 engines have a small bell and some have a large bell. This will determine what adapter plate you need. You can probably tell by putting your hand behind the engine. If it is about flush to where the head bolts, its a big bell. If its about 2 inches below, its a small bell.

Good luck
Ryan
--1965 Ranchero w/1966 200, dual friction diaphram 9" Modern Driveline clutch and billet flywheel all balanced, 1985 SVO WC T5 with front shift, 1966 2.8 Ford 8", 2V converted built 1980 head, Autolite 2100 1.08, Dual out VI headers, Custom curved DUI, 256H Schneider cam 2.5 degrees advanced with dual roller chain, 2" exhaust with H pipe and Flowmaster 40s
--Creator of the only Weber 32/36 conversion video

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #5 by bubba22349 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:05 pm

Okay in checking into this further, so yes You are correct in that the dividing line on the shorter input shaft lengths is end of production of the Fox chassis cars. Then when the SN95 Mustang chassis came out in 1994 the input shaft was indeed 3/4 inch longer and these last two years (1994 1995) of using the 5.0 engines in the Mustangs, a different and longer bell housing to fit those T5's into the SN95 chassis cars. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #6 by Dragonlich1961 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:33 pm

Sn 95 mustangs are 5/8 deaper in the bell housing and the input shaft is longer to match. The front bearing retainer is different to match as well. Buy a kit and swap everything over. I just finished doing this to my 94 unit.
There is a large pattern small trans Bell out there, I had one and had to source a different bell.
Look at the starter and bell housing suface to identify what you have. Look the the trans as well, since it's possible to have the small trans with a large bell.

Clutch is the same as the large trans, standard 10 spline, small uses a different clutch and not sure which one is needed.
Check the new input shaft vs clutch, first one I had did not fit splines due to machining error. I had the company send out a second one and it fit.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #7 by Mach1Mark » Sun Nov 10, 2019 12:34 pm

thanks for help guys. ill look at some u tube videos how to change the input shaft. As far as the big bell? is that what people on the forum are talking about 8 1/4 clutch and 9 inch clutch, or is that something different?. I understand any bell housing beyond year 64 is a "big" bell housing. meaning that the bell housing will fit 200 cu. and small bell fit 140 and 170cu. Am I confused?

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #8 by bubba22349 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 1:58 pm

Actually it's real easy and all this info in the link in my above post about block differences. But to simply it even more see below then check your block casting number to ID what your Mustang has.

The Small Inline Six Blocks

1. All the early small six blocks built from July 1959 (for the first year 1960 Falcon / Comet production run) to end of 1965 model run with block numbers C0DE to C5DE. These early 144, 170 or 200 blocks will only have the bolt pattern for the small six bell housings that were only used with the 8 1/2 inch clutch and dog dish flywheel in the cars, along with a 2.77 trans.

2.In 1966 the C6DE block was the first to have a duel bolt bell housing pattern these engines got the bigger 9 inch clutch and flat type flywheel, or the Duel Range C4 Cruise o Matic that still used the smaller bell housing bolt pattern. Though I can't prove it at this time I think that all the high mount starter 170 and 200 blocks made in 1966 to end of production will likely be the duel bolt pattern blocks. So they can use eigher the larger pattern bell housing for the 9 inch flywheel clutch combo or the small patern bell housing. So far I have not worked on, found, or seen any pictures of a single bell housing pattern D series block or one that was not drilled and tapped with both patterns.

Now if you find that your 1966 Mustang still has it's original engin block than it will be a duel patern block (check the block cast numbers to verify). It should also have the better larger bell housing and 9 inch clutch. Count your starters number of mounting bolts or look for the bell housings casting number to verify this. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #9 by Mach1Mark » Fri Nov 15, 2019 3:59 pm

thanks for help. :D

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #10 by Mach1Mark » Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:51 pm

So I have sourced a bellhousing from 66 3speed manual trans, I have the t5 transmission, I'm just a little confused, the bellhousing (66 3speed) came with the transmission, a new disc, a flywheel and pressure plate also the throwout bearing. So can I reuse those items or do I have to get a new pressure plate and other parts for a v8..also do I need to get a new starter, the current starter on the c4 trans, on the car, I know won't fit a 289 v8 flywheel, the teeth are different. So is the 66 3speed flywheel the same as a v8 flywheel? . Enlighten me I'm a little confused. Thank you guys for your time

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #11 by bubba22349 » Sat Dec 14, 2019 4:39 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:So I have sourced a bellhousing from 66 3speed manual trans, I have the t5 transmission, I'm just a little confused, the bellhousing (66 3speed) came with the transmission, a new disc, a flywheel and pressure plate also the throwout bearing. So can I reuse those items or do I have to get a new pressure plate and other parts for a v8..also do I need to get a new starter, the current starter on the c4 trans, on the car, I know won't fit a 289 v8 flywheel, the teeth are different. So is the 66 3speed flywheel the same as a v8 flywheel? . Enlighten me I'm a little confused. Thank you guys for your time


Hi Mach1Mark, yes you can use all the stock 1966 200 six bell housing, 136 tooth flat flywheel, 9 inch pressure plate & clutch disk, release bearing arm & stock throw out bearing. Just add the correct T5 adapter plate and 1982 to 1993 T5 trans (or a 1994 / 95 T5 trans with a swapped earlier 1993 down shorter T5,input shaft). No you wouldn't want a 289 V8 flywheel it's a larger diameter, the ring gear tooth count is more (157), plus the they are 28 oz. imbalance this won't work on a 200 six or fit in a six cyclinder bell housing anyway. You need a starter with a 2 bolt mounting if your C4 auto trans starter is the three bolt type your choices are to swap out the nose cone for a 2 bolt one, replace the starter with a stock 1966 manual trans starter, or replace it with one of the smaller and lighter mini starters which could give you some extra clearance for a set of headers. Good luck on your T5 swap. :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #12 by Mach1Mark » Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:41 pm

Well, I decided to take the new clutch disc (new old stock from 67), and the throw out bearing and test fit it on the input shaft of the T5. it wouldn't fit, so I need a clutch disc and throwout bearing from a 289 or 302 66 Mustang or 67. Am I correct? Can I use my Fork? And use my 136 tooth flywheel, it takes a 9-inch clutch disk, , I understand the v8 flywheel is weighted so I miss spoke, but I can use my old flywheel...assume I cannot use my "clutch pressure plate assembly"? please tell me what I'm missing. do I have to buy all this from MDL or can I buy like a 289 67 pressure plate assembly with 10 spline pattern from let's rockauto?

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #13 by Mach1Mark » Sat Dec 14, 2019 6:02 pm

Thanks Bubba for responding I am going to test the bearing and the clutch plate again.

I have a 94 t5, I checked it against the original input shaft and also a new shorter shaft for a 93 T5. I test fitted the throwout bearing and the disk against both of these shafts and they did not fit either one. Thanks for your help but I must be missing something..I'm going to test fit them again and see if I did something wrong, I'm also going to measure them.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #14 by Mach1Mark » Sat Dec 14, 2019 6:08 pm

I am reading a section Ford I6 performance handbook page 87. On that page it says the clutch plate needs to Simply measure plate diameter of 9inch and the spline count on the input shaft of your T5 (10 spline I guess) the pressure plate will need to be diaphragm style plate..it also says the Borg & Beck three-finger style will not have clearance in the bellhousing.

So I assume a v8 clutch and pressure plate?

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #15 by bubba22349 » Sat Dec 14, 2019 6:54 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:I am reading a section Ford I6 performance handbook page 87. On that page it says the clutch plate needs to Simply measure plate diameter of 9inch and the spline count on the input shaft of your T5 (10 spline I guess) the pressure plate will need to be diaphragm style plate..it also says the Borg & Beck three-finger style will not have clearance in the bellhousing.

So I assume a v8 clutch and pressure plate?


There are lots of posts on the site for T5 swaps yes many will use the Diafram type clutches but some of them have used the 3 finger Borg and Beck. Check posts by Rick Wrench, Powerband, Stardeigo, ect. Also note if your have a 4 cylinder or V8 T5 they take a different size pilot bearing on a 4 cylinder. The clutch disk for the 1966 parts will need to be a 9 inch diameter size the V8 clutch disk and pressure plate is 10 inch. Is your bell housing for a 3.03 trans? Can you post some pictures of the parts you have?Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #16 by Mach1Mark » Sat Dec 14, 2019 9:37 pm

Well back to more research. I was thinking it was buy A part and B part and put it on C. I guess not. Thanks for ur help.

The 3 speed 66 bell housing has the 2 bolt starter with 9inch 136 toothe flywheel.

The t5 is a 94 v8 mustang , with a 93 shorter shaft 10spline..

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #17 by bubba22349 » Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:13 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:Well back to more research. I was thinking it was buy A part and B part and put it on C. I guess not. Thanks for ur help.

The 3 speed 66 bell housing has the 2 bolt starter with 9inch 136 toothe flywheel.

The t5 is a 94 v8 mustang , with a 93 shorter shaft 10spline..


Ok the bad thing is the 1966 bell housing was a one year only parts combo that requires a little different handeling then the 1967 up 200's parts combos.

So here's your customized parts list of what's needed to do your a T5 swap! First all these stock 1966 three speed trans parts can be used for a T5 swap.

1. You can use the 1966 bell housing you just need to be sure to use the right T5 adapter plate to fit a 66 bell. This is the narrow trans pateren adapter plate.

2. You can also use the stock 1966 clutch linkage (Z bar, linkage rods, clutch pedal, return spring, ect.) or optionally you could change it over to a cable type pedel kit if you want.

3. Two bolt starter for a 200 manual trans car. Example this is stock for a 1966 Mustang with a three speed standard / manual trans. If you have or can find the nose cone arts (rear of starter) your C4 starter can be converted.

4. The 1966 tin block plate for a manual trans bell housing should be used between the block and bell housing it is installed first before the flywheel goes on.

5. The flywheel is the correct 9 inch flat style use it. Check the surface and if need be have it surfaced so it is flat and true and get the correct lenght bolts (stock Ford or ARP) to install the flywheel (they are longer then the C4 flex plate bolts) put some sealer on the threads and torque to spec.

6. The 3 finger pressure Plate could be used or optionally it could be changed out to a Diafram type clutch kit they have a little easier pedel feel / pushing it in compared to the three finger pressure plate. Make sure you have the correct pressure plate bolts they have a shoulder that fits into the flywheel (stock Ford or ARP) torque to spec.

7. The 1966 throwout bearing arm / release arm can be used with the correct 1967 throwout bearing.

8. Your 1994 T5 with the installed shorter (earlier 1993 down) input shaft is correct for this swap.

These are all the Parts you will need to acquire and use in place of the 1966 Parts

9. The 1966 clutch disk can't be used, it was for a 2.77 trans it's the wrong spline count as you noted above. You will need to get and use a 1967 up Mustang 200 disk for a 3.03 trans (that has the 10 spines).

10. The 1966 throw out bearing can't be used you need to get and use the 1967 up Mustang 200 throwout bearing for a 3.03 trans.

11. The crankshaft pilot bearing you need to use with a V8 T5 trans needs to be the one for a 1967 up Mustang 200 with a 3.03 trans. This is the first item to be installed before the flywheel is installed.

12. You will need a T5 conversion type crossmember or be able to build your own.

13. You will need to get a T5 trans yoke, and may possibly need to shorten your driveshaft though some have been able to use their current C4 driveshaft.

Best of luck on your T5 swap. :thumbup: :nod: Edited
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #18 by Mach1Mark » Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:28 pm

Thanks for your response that actually helped a lot. Cleared a few things up for me.

however I do have a new clutch disc that is stamped c67, the splines will fit the 3-speed and will not fit the t5. So I guess I will have to buy a new clutch disc anyway. Thank you for your help... I will try to put this thing together, and of course if I have questions I will certainly ask
.. again, thanks

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #19 by bubba22349 » Sat Dec 14, 2019 11:58 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:Thanks for your response that actually helped a lot. Cleared a few things up for me.

however I do have a new clutch disc that is stamped c67, the splines will fit the 3-speed and will not fit the t5. So I guess I will have to buy a new clutch disc anyway. Thank you for your help... I will try to put this thing together, and of course if I have questions I will certainly ask
.. again, thanks


Your are very welcome and am glad I was able to be of help and if you need more info let me know. You might pick up a V8 T5 clutch input shaft alignment tool to use to check the clutch disk (or you could haul your T5 in) when your hunting for your new disk. Also if you got the stock clutch linage (Z Bar ect.) you should be able to use that too unless you are planing to use a Cable Clutch Conversion Kit. :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #20 by Mach1Mark » Sun Dec 15, 2019 9:59 am

Thanks again,.. very helpful. I thought about it,.. my clutch disc, although its new old stock is stamped C 6 7, so it is not actually a 67 it's a 66. I don't know what the 7 is for,.. very confusing. That may explain why my new clutch disc does not fit the 10 spline T5. I have an extra shaft that I purchased to change my 94 to a 93 shorter shaft on the T5,..so that helps when I'm shopping for the clutch plate. Although I never thought of an alignment tool, very smart! Thanks

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #21 by bubba22349 » Sun Dec 15, 2019 11:59 am

Can't answer the C67 on your disk except that some of the clutch manufacturers and rebuilders often have their own numbering system. On older Fords if it was a Genuine Ford part the Ford part numbers were stamped into the disk center later on they used a painted number. If the disk is still in its orginal packaging you could I'd it from the Ford part number.

The first year Ford started using the excellent 3.03 trans behind the 200 six in Mustangs and other Ford cars was 1967 that's why your disk won't fit the T5. Well that's excellent since you have an extra input shaft you can use it both for your disk hunt and as a clutch alignement tool too when you start to assemble the parts. :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #22 by Mach1Mark » Sun Dec 15, 2019 12:34 pm

Anyone want to but a working 3 speed 1966 transmission with a new clutch disk? Haha

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trans/clutch sale

Post #23 by chad » Sun Dec 15, 2019 12:45 pm

details, details !
We havea 4 Sale forum
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #24 by bubba22349 » Sun Dec 15, 2019 1:25 pm

:rolflmao: you never know I have a 1965 Mustang 2.77 trans with shifter, throughout bearing and clutch disk setting in my shop that I don't need too. You could put a for sale add in the sale / trade section of the site forums. It's down at bottom of all the forum topics, it's free and just might be of some help to another site member in getting their project car back on the road. :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #25 by Mach1Mark » Tue Dec 17, 2019 11:44 am

So if I have the 2.77 or the 3.03 transmission can I use the 9-inch flywheel and bellhousing and fork for either transmission,. I assume the adapter plate is not the same.

National Parts Depot has 3 adapter plates one for the 9-inch, and one for the for the 2.77 and another part number for the 200 3sM/T...it might be the same part with different number,..they have a 13A for the 2.77, a 10A for the 9" with 2bolt starter, and 14A for 3sM/T, it does not clarify in the parts book, if I ask them they don't know, most of those guys are Chevy guys, hahaha.

I know I can call mdl, but to call that guy and ask a bunch of questions constantly, and not buy from him direct, its not right, although he probably supplies NPD... oh, I'm sure that he's got better things to do. (Ya I know , like u guys dont have better things to do, Haha)

The reason why I want to buy from NPD because NPD is right here in Charlotte. I can purchase a part and if I don't need it or doesn't fit I can return it. They're really good that way.

So whatever I have? 2.77 or the 3.03 can I use the flywheel, fork and bellhousing, is the adaptor for the 9inch the correct one? I think I have the 3.03. I can send you a pic to private message, but I do not know how to send it or post it here.

My flywheel is for a 9 inch clutch, it is 136 tooth, and the shorter 1967 starter for the will fit. I assume the starter's for 136 tooth? From Autozone, I asked for a 1967 6 cyl 200 starter, and that's what they handed me.. its 2 bolt and fits the holes.

Again, thanks for your help. I tried to read all the post here on the t5 swap. They meanderer and run on about paint color and other things...I have to read and read and read to get what I need and it's very confusing. this is why I'm asking simple, I hope simple questions, and to the point.

I appreciate you taking the time to respond, you are really helpful, thanks!

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T5 swap '66 mustang 200

Post #26 by chad » Tue Dec 17, 2019 2:08 pm

"... I tried to read all the post here on the t5 swap. They meanderer and run on about..."
that's what many of us do often to answ a Q some 1 has. It becomes a group built project that way :shock:
We don't have real solid rules on how we enter info, keeps it a lill chatty (which I like) no strict adherence, no 'tossed off the form', etc. (well, sometimes).
If U wish. when U get dwn da rd a lill w/this mod - It Would B Great if you grouped ur info-learned together. This way the nxt guy duz not hafta go thru what U did to collect info for an identical project. Wish to do so? help the nxt guy? Isn't that called a 'stickie'?
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #27 by bubba22349 » Tue Dec 17, 2019 4:37 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:So if I have the 2.77 or the 3.03 transmission can I use the 9-inch flywheel and bellhousing and fork for either transmission,. I assume the adapter plate is not the same.

National Parts Depot has 3 adapter plates one for the 9-inch, and one for the for the 2.77 and another part number for the 200 3sM/T...it might be the same part with different number,..they have a 13A for the 2.77, a 10A for the 9" with 2bolt starter, and 14A for 3sM/T, it does not clarify in the parts book, if I ask them they don't know, most of those guys are Chevy guys, hahaha.

I know I can call mdl, but to call that guy and ask a bunch of questions constantly, and not buy from him direct, its not right, although he probably supplies NPD... oh, I'm sure that he's got better things to do. (Ya I know , like u guys dont have better things to do, Haha)

The reason why I want to buy from NPD because NPD is right here in Charlotte. I can purchase a part and if I don't need it or doesn't fit I can return it. They're really good that way.

So whatever I have? 2.77 or the 3.03 can I use the flywheel, fork and bellhousing, is the adaptor for the 9inch the correct one? I think I have the 3.03. I can send you a pic to private message, but I do not know how to send it or post it here.

My flywheel is for a 9 inch clutch, it is 136 tooth, and the shorter 1967 starter for the will fit. I assume the starter's for 136 tooth? From Autozone, I asked for a 1967 6 cyl 200 starter, and that's what they handed me.. its 2 bolt and fits the holes.

Again, thanks for your help. I tried to read all the post here on the t5 swap. They meanderer and run on about paint color and other things...I have to read and read and read to get what I need and it's very confusing. this is why I'm asking simple, I hope simple questions, and to the point.

I appreciate you taking the time to respond, you are really helpful, thanks!


The 1966 Ford Mustang was a transitional year were Ford introduced the 9 inch clutch and flat flywheel yet kept some of the earlier parts. I think I answered your questions in my above post #17 I tried reediting it some to try and make more clear, see below for a link to it. You f you still need more info let me know or if you want to send me pictures of your parts so I can look at them to see what all parts you have then I will let you know If it all of them work togeather and or could post the pictures for you. Also if you send me the links to the NPD parts I can figure out the adapter that fits your bell housing too. Just click on my posting name above and send me a PM (private message) so I can give you an email address to send the pictures too. Good luck. :thumbup: :nod: Edited to try and make it clearer.

Post #17
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=80505#p625703
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #28 by bubba22349 » Tue Dec 17, 2019 10:13 pm

Hi Mach1 Mark, I re- edited my above post & #17 to see if I could make a bit clearer for you and hopefully easier to understand.
I also looked up those adapter plates at NPD looks like you could use any one of the # 6392-14A, #6392-13A, plates or if you wanted the compleate kit with crossmember and trans mount then #6392-11A would be the ticket. Let me know if you need anymore help. :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #29 by Mach1Mark » Wed Dec 18, 2019 4:19 pm

Hey thanks, that is a little clearer. I appreciate u putting the time in and helping. To throw another wrench in the fire. I'm thinking a hydraulic clutch throwout bearing. I haven't really looked at any threads yet on that, but it looks pretty simple. I was thinking of using a jeep wrangler reservoir and just need the bearing any suggestions. I'll do a little research

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T5 swap w/hydro clutch behind 66/200

Post #30 by chad » Wed Dec 18, 2019 5:24 pm

go ford, don't the modern all have em?
(see what's ina stang)
ranger B4 gone, the ZF 5 speeds, expo, expi, explo (..all the "e"s...)
they hang em (slave) inside the bell, havea master outside stuck to the peddle
and a 'gland' around the berring (to move it).

I skipped the ZF (truck) due to the hydro clutch, don't want it.
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #31 by Mach1Mark » Thu Dec 19, 2019 7:43 am

Come to think of it,... I did have a 1990 ranger, it had a hydraulic slave throwout bearing. So the ford ranger setup? The master cylinder was small to. I thought the 90s mustangs had cable and a manual throwout bearing,
but my 4cyl ranger was hydraulic. I checked autozone, and yes the 6cyl and 4 cylinder for the ranger has a slave hydraulic throwout bearing, while the mustang has a manual bearing. (According to the autozone website).

I'm going to take my sleeve and go to autozone and test fit it, I'll bet it will fit...odd?... Any thoughts?

Thanks for the response Chad, what is "gland.. around the bearing to move it?" Thanks

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #32 by chad » Thu Dec 19, 2019 9:23 am

"...they hang em (slave) inside the bell, havea master outside stuck to the peddle
and a 'gland' around the berring (to move it). ..."
when U step on break peddle (activate MC) the slave sends juice dwn the line so that the lill bearing swells up & disengages.
Can't say it any simpler (may B clearer writing tho. aaahahahaaaa). Gotta B a scientist to decipher my 54!+... 8^0

Moders use the Ranger
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #33 by bubba22349 » Fri Dec 20, 2019 8:11 am

Mach1Mark wrote:Hey thanks, that is a little clearer. I appreciate u putting the time in and helping. To throw another wrench in the fire. I'm thinking a hydraulic clutch throwout bearing. I haven't really looked at any threads yet on that, but it looks pretty simple. I was thinking of using a jeep wrangler reservoir and just need the bearing any suggestions. I'll do a little research


Going with a Hydrolic clutch is going to add some more cost to your project. The only type that could work without going to a custom made bell housing (Quick Time) is the internal slave.

With that in mine you would

A. Not use the throwout bearing arm

B. And the stock clutch linkage also isn't used.

C. Generally the pressure plates used with these internal slave systems are of the Diafram type so that maybe also need to be changed.

So of your current parts you would now only use these few parts

1. The Tin Block plate

2. The 66 Bellhousing

3. The 9 inch flywheel

4. The two bolt starter.

You might look at Modern Driveline on the Hydrolic clutch parts they have one for the T5 as well as the cable type kits too. Good luck on the swap. :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #34 by Mach1Mark » Fri Dec 20, 2019 9:09 am

The more I read about the hydraulic slave T/O bearing the more complicated it seems to be. Mustang Steve makes a nice clutch pedal ready to receive the wire . I might go that way. Or stick with the Zbar. Its funny,..I purched a c4 about 10yrs ago , (1972 maverick) I rebuilt it myself, slapped it in, no change to the driveshaft or rear end, and I have been driving and abusing it for this long, and that was less complicated then this t5 swap. Who knew?

Quick question, can I use my c4 tin block plate on the t5 swap? I think I would just have to drill some holes for the starter.

Also, wiill the shifter of the t5 slip right into the stock floor hole. MDL says I have to buy there $300 shift adaptor.
Last edited by Mach1Mark on Fri Dec 20, 2019 4:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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T5 swap '66 200 - currently C4

Post #35 by chad » Fri Dec 20, 2019 10:51 am

also: addition/changes to consol & geta 3rd peddle
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #36 by bubba22349 » Fri Dec 20, 2019 1:20 pm

No on using the C4 block plate. It’s the smaller block pattern so it won’t fit the larger bell housings used with the flat flywheels and a 9 inch clutch. I have seen some that use the stock Ford floor shift three speed handle on their T5 swaps. The MDL shifter kit is nice though as are all their parts.

Yes for sure the C4 is much easier to install, more reasonable in cost, easy to work on like installing a good shift kit, (rebuilds are reasonable too), is an excellent and bullet proof strong transmission. It's one of my all time favorites, when using a 1972 up trans as a starting point only needs the addition of a TranGo shift kit and auxiliary trans cooler, I also like installing a low gear set in them too known as a poor mans overdrive when used with a taller rear axle gear ratio. Good luck. :thumbup: :nod: Edited
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #37 by chad » Fri Dec 20, 2019 4:14 pm

post #34 wuz the 1st time I saw he wuz swaping a C4 to this T5:
"...I rebuilt it myself, slapped it in, no change to the driveshaft or rear end, and I have been driving and abusing it for this long, and that was less complicated then this t5 swap..."
'S Y I added prts in my post #35
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #38 by Mach1Mark » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:18 am

I will post on my progress to help the other guy. This process of replacing my C4 with a t5 transmission will take a while.

So I ordered a "dynocorn" replacement brake and clutch pedal from Ebay, It is coming from Kentucky mustang. It was the cheapest clutch and brake pedals I have found. Used pedals are outrageously priced And NPD is expensive also. So hopefully that will work to start the process. I will keep u informed. I wish I could post pics here, but still dont know how.

Anyway, purchased a used 95 t5. I ordered a new shorter input shaft from Ebay. Seem to be nice quality, bearing and shims came with it. I removed the existing input shaft and trans,.. looks real nice on the inside. Cross my fingers and knock on wood. Haha.

Cleaned up the 1966 bellhousing and Im in the process of painting both. Might as well , it has to look good under the car.

I will install the input shaft soon. (Plenty of videos on YouTube). Then go to NPD and purchase the adaptor plate and clutch assembly. I will probably have the old 1966 flywheel resurfaced. If there are any opinions about this, I welcome them.

I did purchase a short nose starter from autozone, (136 teeth for 9inch clutch) I may return that and get a high performance one from NPD or Amazon or Ebay. Again any opinions are welcome.

That's it for right now. Thanks for ur help.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #39 by bubba22349 » Mon Dec 23, 2019 11:44 am

Yes depending on condition of your flywheel a light cut is a good idea. I like the newer hi torque starters as they are smaller (especially if you plan or have headers), lighter, and spin the motor faster for quicker start ups. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #40 by Mach1Mark » Mon Dec 23, 2019 1:36 pm

Where did you get your starter? In the NPD catalog it is not real clear which starter goes to what motor.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #41 by bubba22349 » Mon Dec 23, 2019 5:10 pm

The base number for this Ford starter application is 3157 this is for the old style large case starter used from the early 1960's through to 1983 (end of production of the small block six). With this number you can cross referance it over to the Mini Starters, here is a listing showing all the applications of this mini style starter see the below link.

https://robbmcperformance.com/products/ ... arter.html

Note that Fords have two different starter offsets 3/8 or 3/4 inch as well as two or three bolt mountings. You can figure out the offset by measuring from the face of the starter mounting boss to the flywheel face. Generally the 3/8 inch off set is for a manual trans and the 3/4 inch fits an auto trans. If you want the old style large case starter as an example look for a 1967 to 70 Falcon or Mustang with a 200 six and manual trans (a two bolt).

If you want to go with a stock Ford style mini type starter look for a 1992 to 96 5.0 with a 5 speed trans (also is used on some late 4.9 EFI (300) engines used in F150 pickup with a 5 speed. These stock type starters are quit good and are the ones I have most often used on my budget builds. On my next all out build though I am planing to use the RobbMc mini starter in above link. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #42 by Invectivus » Tue Dec 24, 2019 9:44 am

Be super careful about the snout measurement, I put a robbmc starter on my 200/c4 and it was awesome. I swapped to a t5 and didn’t re-measure, and mangled the snout. It was not inexpensive to fix, and they didn’t make a mounting plate for my specific setup. I’d have to dig up my emails, but IIRC, I bought a 302 plate and had an acquaintance weld a new ear on it for my bolt pattern.
1967 mustang coupe - 200ci, 69 dizzy, adjustable rockers, headers and dual exhaust, T5.

1964 convertible falcon - Gutted.

1973 EB Bronco - 302ci (sorry!) DUI ignition, C4/D20, Dana 44, 33's

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #43 by Mach1Mark » Tue Dec 24, 2019 10:19 am

That's some good info. I'll have to measure once and cut twice. Lol. Thanks for ur help.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #44 by Mach1Mark » Fri Dec 27, 2019 11:38 am

Another " quick " question. Apparently my flywheel 136 tooth for a 9-inch clutch has some teeth missing. I could pay the $45 to have it resurfaced and cross my fingers that the starter doesn't get locked up on the missing teeth.

So I'm trying to find a new flywheel. Yes I can purchase one for $250 to $400. But like most people on this website we are trying to do it on the cheap.

O'Reilly and AutoZone have a 9-inch clutch flywheel. That looks like it would work. Its for a 1984 SVO 4 cylinder turbo Mustang,.. all the dimensions look correct, but I don't know about the bolt pattern in the center.

However, it says 132 teeth. So will this flywheel work? (Of course then I have to figure out the starter problem). Autozone, o'riley, Napa, do not have a listing for a flywheel for 1980 Fairmont or a 1967 Mustang or 66 Mustang with a 3.3 L.

It does seem that I can use the 1978 through the 1980 Fairmont, Granada clutch set... the question is , can I? Also, I guess I can use the Fairmount, Granada pilot bearing
What would you guys do? Again thanks

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #45 by bubba22349 » Fri Dec 27, 2019 12:20 pm

Mach1Mark wrote:Another " quick " question. Apparently my flywheel 136 tooth for a 9-inch clutch has some teeth missing. I could pay the $45 to have it resurfaced and cross my fingers that the starter doesn't get locked up on the missing teeth.

So I'm trying to find a new flywheel. Yes I can purchase one for $250 to $400. But like most people on this website we are trying to do it on the cheap.

O'Reilly and AutoZone have a 9-inch clutch flywheel. That looks like it would work. Its for a 1984 SVO 4 cylinder turbo Mustang,.. all the dimensions look correct, but I don't know about the bolt pattern in the center.

However, it says 132 teeth. So will this flywheel work? (Of course then I have to figure out the starter problem). Autozone, o'riley, Napa, do not have a listing for a flywheel for 1980 Fairmont or a 1967 Mustang or 66 Mustang with a 3.3 L.

It does seem that I can use the 1978 through the 1980 Fairmont, Granada clutch set... the question is , can I? Also, I guess I can use the Fairmount, Granada pilot bearing
What would you guys do? Again thanks


Engines tend to stop in the same location so when a starter goes bad and its left unrepared it damages the ring gear in that location and you can also count on a bad ring gear taking out a new starter. If the flywheel is decent otherwise why not just get a new ring gear to replace the damaged one it's fairly easy to change out and should be quite low cost compared to getting another flywheel. In a real time pinch to get a car or truck back in service many ring gears have been taken off, flipped over and or staggered, but as cheap as a new ring gear it's much better to get a new one since you will have some time to locate one. I would say the 2.3 L SVO flywheel isn't going to be a direct bolt on either so will likely to add additional trouble to your swap. Good luck :thumbup: :nod:
A bad day Drag Racing is still better than a good day at work!

I am still hunting for a project car to build but with my current low budget it's not looking so good. My Ex- Fleet of Sixes these are all long gone! :bang: 1954 Customline 223 3 speed with O/D, 1963 Fairlane project drag car with BB6, 1977 Maverick 250 with C4, 1994 F-150 a 300 with 5 speed.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #46 by Mach1Mark » Fri Dec 27, 2019 1:35 pm

Those are good ideas, how about the Granada Fairmont clutch assembly set is that the right fit?

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T5 swap to '66 200

Post #47 by chad » Fri Dec 27, 2019 3:59 pm

"...Granada/Fairmont..."
don't forget, they had 3 or 4 motors
"Big thing is only make one change at a time. Change 2 or more things at a time it becomes difficult to figure which change helped or hurt" turbo2256b » 1/16/2017
Chad - '70 LUEB on '77 frame (i.e. PS, D44, trapezoidal BB 9", 4.11), '69 250ci, NV 3550 & DSII, "T" D20/PTO, 2" SL, 1" BL, 4 discs, 33"X15", tool boxes, etc. Seeking: Hydraulic gear motor for Koenig pto. chrlsful@aol.com (413) 259-1749

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #48 by Mach1Mark » Fri Dec 27, 2019 9:00 pm

Sorry, I apologize. To clarify, the 78 through 80 Fairmont or Granada 3.3 L 200 cdi. I believe these parts stores have a diagram style clutch set for significantly less money. I read in some past post that these cars have the same clutch set has the 66 Mustang 200 straight 6. So instead of paying National Parts Depot $300 for their clutch set. I can get a clutch set from a 78 through 80 Fairmont or Granada for about $100 from one of these parts stores. Will these clutch sets work for my vehicle. Just clarifying.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #49 by Dragonlich1961 » Fri Dec 27, 2019 10:44 pm

national parts depo should have the a ring gear, i replaced mine after i had my flywheel resurfaced. Use an acetlyne torch to heat the old one up and drive it off, then use the torch to heat the new one up( or the wifes oven) and it should drop on no hammer needed. i belive the fairmont clutch will work but you will still need to source a through out bearing to match your year bell. The fairmont uses a cable clutch and diffrent fork setup.

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Re: t5 swap 66 mustang 200

Post #50 by Mach1Mark » Fri Dec 27, 2019 10:49 pm

Well thanks for the reply, I just looked on National Parts Depot and they are out of stock for the 136th tooth ring gear. I will call them and see if I can get one, I might just have to buy the whole ring gear flywheel set which is roughly about $250 ....get them while you can.

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