lots of engine rebuild questions

[mysavioreigns]

Well, I'm getting my new engine on Saturday (or before) and I'll be rebuilding it to put it into my mustang. I have lots of questions

Firstoff, I got a few pictures of it. now, I know you can't tell an engine by a picture, but I can tell you this: The PO said the engine had sat for a couple years. The picture shows a freshly painted engine (which anybody could do) but it also shows a firewall and shock towers which are all cleaned up. I don't think someone would go through all this process and just throw a coat of paint on the engine. Could be, but I doubt it.

Anyways, after talking with Tony 250Mav, he suggested I get a gasket kit, motor mounts, oil pump, and a double roller timing chain.

When I put the timing chain on, what is so hard about it? Everyone makes it out to be a big deal, but I have read over kastang's how-to site, and it looks pretty easy. Also, will I need to grind down the surface to get it on?

Second question:
I have only like ~$1000 to do this. That means the engine, tools, stands, hoists, and parts, have to fall under $1000. What all do I NEED to change. The things above I will be changing. Which stuff do I need of the following: Camshaft, lifters, pushrods, retainers, valves, valve springs, freeze plugs, valve cover, main bearings.

Last, will hydraulic lifters work w/o a problem? If they work better/more reliable, I may look into that.

This is my daily driver currently, but I don't have the money, time, or knowledge to go all out on a complete rebuild. I would just like a car that is reliable for several years.

 

[addo]

Your comments suggest to me that you haven't been that far into an engine before.

Coupled with the statement "This is my daily driver currently..." I think it's wholly the wrong time to undertake such an exercise.

Use the condition of its plugs, as a guide to whether the head even needs to come off.

 

[mysavioreigns]

you'd be right. I've never been into one. I know how they work, but I have no on-hands experience.

Sorry, i forgot to clarify on the driver thing. See, my engine sorta blew up last week but luckily, I had this one lined up as a backup. Well, it's time came a lot quicker than I thought, so that's where I am.

 

[addo]

OK, so getting it back and running is priority. If the plugs are just a bit dirty, or reddish-tinged, replace them and you're good to go.

If they're massively loaded with wet-looking oily crud, whip off the head. Look for "ridging" on the bores, up-and-down scoring, burnt valve edges, too-hard valve stem seals, and while you can - measure the piston dish, deck height and head CC.

Pull the lifters one at a time and check their bases for ever-so-slight convexity. It's a 40" radius, so not massively obvious. If they're dead flat when laid on a surface table, or worn concave then you can expect cam issues. Should be OK, though, so goop the top and bottom of each with cam lube and reinstall in original order. Apply cam lube to each end of the pushrods, too.

That's about as far as you should go in the short term unless a clear and significant fault is noted. When you reassemble, don't forget to allow at least an hour but preferably overnight, between the second and final torquings of your head bolts. Also oil or moly grease the head bolt threads when installing.

Later on, I would suggest maybe getting a regrind on your cam from the blown up engine, and fitting it with new or reconditioned lifters and a double roller timing set.

 

[mysavioreigns]

Ah, I see. I forgot to mention, I was told the the engine runs, so you're right - I guess it doesn't really need the dual roller chain (that'll be for later).

I guess I haven't read my book close enough, or I don't remember. I will need to torque 3 times? I guess it makes sense, for it to be completely (and correctly) secured.

I will get some pics and I'll do some diagnosing over th next couple days and see what I can figure out, and report back. Thanks again, addo

 

[lyonsy]

if it runs id just put the engine in get it runnng.
then get a 2nd engine a stand and a tension wrench which all up will prob cost $500+ then do that engine with no rush since it will be your first.

 

[mysavioreigns]

Well I got the engine yesterday, got my hoist, and my stand, and a level loader. I built the stand and the hoist (HUGE) and realized it was going to be quite a job by myself. So I called a friend, and triumphantly ( ) we got the engine/trans out of the truck.

A couple things I noticed were:

The engine was painted, but a shoddy job. the PO just pretty much rattlecanned it for a quick sell. I'm REALLY guessing no rebuild has been done, but you never know till you crack it open.

Everything is really dirty, but not too rusty. Not a lot of oil either.[/list]

 

[addo]

There is a little forensic work to do now.

Start looking for traces of the original colour. Now scratch around where the head gasket is visible, in that "sandwich" between the head and block. See what thickness the gasket looks (compare to feeler gauge stack) and whether there's paint on the gasket.

Got any motor pics?

 

[mysavioreigns]

Went to take a picture, and the camera ran out of batteries. I'll try and get some today.

Took the transmission off, because I need to get the engine up on the stand. I can't get the dang bolts off the torque converter, and I don't want to risk rounding them off. I sprayed them with some PB Blaster before I left last night.

The head gasket has paint on it. I'm erked now - guy just simply painted it like a week ago I bet. The trans has about 1/2" of mud all over it. I'm wondering if it was a track car or something.

 

[addo]

If the head gasket has original paint on it then the motor should be standard bore and have the thin gasket.

While that means it's probably not rebuilt, it also means you have a blank canvas.

Transmissions do attract mud in my experience. A little oil contamination to the outside, and it just builds up and up. Tape up the breather hole before pressure washing it!

 

[cobraguy]

Get the casting numbers and post them. You will find the block numbers between the starter and passenger side motor mount. Should be a letter then a number then a couple more letters. The head numbers will be on the top of the intake log near the carb. This will help identify what you really have. I would also pull the valve cover and look at the condition of the valve train. If it's all covered with sludge and goo it wasn't taking good care of.

 

[mysavioreigns]

Guys,
Been a couple days - I know I shouldn't, but I've been relaxing after a stressful week, and haven't done much on the engine :x

I got the valve cover off for a look, while the engine is still sittin on the ground. I need to get the torque converter off, and I'm down to the last nut. I didn't get any #s yet, but I did memorize it starts with C6, so at least it is what he said it was.

When I pulled the valve cover, I noticed there was a bunch of crud on the rocker assembly, springs, etc. It sorta looks like the mud after a lake has dried up. Sorta crinkly oil - it's hard to explain. I had the camera, but had no batteries

So my question is, what is the best way of cleaning parts? Especially the" valve/rocker/spring assembly, the head, and the block. Oh, and I'm on a cheap budget

 

[bigcatchdaniel555]

Not sure if your doing a rebuild on the head but my head was being completely redone so I didnt mind it. My motor was 40 years old and full ofsludge just like yours is I removed the head and disassembled it then I went and got a hard brissel brush and used oven cleaner to take the thick sludge off. I tried everything before it butnothing could cut all the way through the sludge. Oven cleaner worked greatjust make sure you rinse the head consistantly and wear skin and eye and nose protection because the cleaner will burn your nose eyes and skin but it was the quickest and cheapest way to clean the parts.

 

[Anonymous]

Dang savior, I thought that was supposed to be a "good running" engine. If the rockers are that cruddy you should probably check the oil pan as well. Didn't your old engine fail because you had a bunch of crud built up in the oil pan giving false dipstick readings?

I think you need to at least clean up the valve gear (don't get any in the engine) and take a look in the crankcase.

JMO

 

[addo]

Sounds to me like an engine that's not been touched for a long time. "Name and shame" the seller?

Unless the funds are there for a rebuild, be very careful about what's loosened up by unbolting stuff. You could have flakes of oily, gritty sludge dropping into parts where they will actually do more damage than if slowly washed away by regular oil changes and an additive.

 

[mysavioreigns]

Yea, i was screwed. I was told that this was a running engine, and there is not a chance in the world that is true.

Hey TexasAxMan, when did you get over here?

I'll check out the crank area next, and let you guys know what I see. I'm really contemplating just pulling my engine and rebuilding it, as I know it was taken care of before all this. This new one on the other hand...

 

[Bort62]

It probably is a runner.

Doesn't mean it runs great.

 

[mysavioreigns]

Well I think I am over my head in this ($$$) so I decided to sell it (going an alternative way I'll tell ya'll about later). I hope I can make back some of the money I bought this thing for. Anyways, I appreciate all the help guys, and when I get some more time and another daily driver, hopefully I can put the mustang on the front burner and get it built to my specs. Again, thanks!

 

[Anonymous]

I know who it was, but if saviour doesn't want to tell, I won't either.

 

[mysavioreigns]

You don't think he'd take it back do ya?

Isn't there a "code" not to do that? haha...