starter problem 200 c/4

[64falconsix]

well here's the problem was getting ready to set the timeing when i hit the starter i heard a rattling sound like something loose rolling around in the bell housing. i pulled the starter and the starter drive had come apart and the guts were what was being slung around by the converter this is a newly built engine and has been started a couple of dozen times. the trans is a c7 code c/4 . I put a new fly wheel in when i built the motor. new starter [3 bolt starter]the engine/ block plate is there. i noticed that there is a area all the way around the top edge of the starter drive that looks like it has been rubbing on something and eventually wore thru I cant see were it may have been rubbing. i will check tomorrow by turning it over by hand and checking every point around the flex plate. also double checked the starter seems to be the correct part for that application. any suggestions while i sit here and scratch my head any input would be appreiciated. check out the pics the red arrow shows were it has been rubbing and the second pic shows whats left of the end of the drive.

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[baker62]

I had the same problem on a Fairlane I had. Never found out what caused it. I replaced the starter and flywheel and the tranny because of the metal shavings. After that I never had a problem.

 

[Broncitis]

Are you sure it just wasn't your starter making all the noise, your drive gear on your starter doesn't look that bad, have someone turn your engine over by hand while you look at the ring gear teeth with a flash light, if it looks good , put another starter in and be on your way, any pieces from the starter most likely just fell to the bottom, just be careful to listen carefully when you put the new starter on, if you still have sounds you will have to pull the bell housing.

 

[FalconSedanDelivery]

after years of use OR a bad rebuild / cheap rebuilt unit , the clip allows the bendix to move too far forward , it rams the flywheel and causes the problem seen here , just replace the starter , not worth rebuilding yourself , should cost 49.00 or less at any autozne , etc

 

[64falconsix]

thanks for the response. i was able to get a closer look at things today , the edge of the bendix is hitting the flex plate and eventually wore thru the case. i have thought about it the bad rebuilt starter theory . the wear pattern on the teeth show full engagement. i will compare it to another starter tomorrow. the bendix seems to be moving too far forward like falcon sedan delivery suggests.as for the loose parts i took the dust cover off the trans and was able to fish out 3 of the 4 missing rollers, springs and a split washer from the bendix.

 

[Broncitis]

I didn't know you had a dust cover, your good to go with a new starter.

 

[jzgut9110024]

hey guys, I am having a similiar problem. I rebuilt the engine over the summer and everything had been working fine. Then a few weeks ago it started making a rattling/tapping sound everytime I would accelerate. Once I got going about 25 to 30 mph it would stop. I check all the bolts to make sure everything was on tight. I did put in a new torque converter when we did the rebuild but kept the same starter. I have checked out the started but didnt take it apart. My mechanic/good friend doesnt think its the started. He thinks it might be the torque converter.

 

[PaulS]

A "rattle" sound can be a lot of different things, from preignition knock to a cracked drive plate (flex plate). A cracked flex plate will rattle more (or only) when there is no load. It may ratle in neutral but go away in drive. If the rattle happens under acceleration then it is more likely spark knock from carbon build up or timing set to far advanced or even a drop in the octane rating of the gas you are using.
Start by checking your timing. Check it at 3000 RPM with an advancing light or by marking the crank up to 40 degrees. Disconnect the vacuum advance to check your timing and make sure the engine is at 3000 rpm. Initial timing needs to be limited so the maximum advance is kept to 34 to 38 degrees at 3000 RPM. If it goes over that amount you are setting the initial timing to far or you need to limit the amount of advance in the distributors mechanical advance.

 

[64falconsix]

the starter problem has been fixed . I picked up another rebuild with no luck i had the same problem starter drive hitting the flex plate when it engages. flex plate was good . checked torque converter engagement that was good. block plate installed. after much research i found a technical service bullitin from the ford motor company for the problem i was having. their reason was from a worn crankshaft thrust bearing. the TSB was for v8 and 6 engines built from IICRC 63 thru 91. they built a .090 shim to correct the problem. although not availiable from ford anymore you can get them at all of the major auto part chains. I just built the engine so i ruled out the thrust bearing. during a web search i found several people with fresh rebuilds having the same issue.i have worked on fords for 25 years and have never heard of a ford starter shim. hope this helps anyone else that runs into this problem.