turbo update finally

[addo]

What a great post. Really sounds like a fun vehicle. Painted a terrific mental picture.

Hey, if it is the head gasket, how long did you leave it before the next step of torque, each time?

Also, there is another trick used with some alloy motors that may work in your case. After 40-60 minutes run time on a new gasket, you let the engine cool to just warmer than tepid, and retorque the head bolts.

Looking forward to both the post-mortem and next run!

Regards, Adam.

 

[Does10s]

Kirk,
Ya give Mike a call and get the Corteco gasket. We're going to put one on in a week or so.
We popped two Fel-pros so far. The Corteco folks said that we shouldn't be able to blow their gasket. (although I'll believe that when I see it!)

BTW the cyl. that blew on Kelly's car was #6....both times. By the looks of our #6 piston we're definately running lean on that one. Probably the same problem you're having.
#6 is notably hotter that the other holes due to it's location. So you might want to try and put an REALLY cold plug in just #6. Might want to try using the Autolite AR33 plugs. If you need a couple to try, I've got about a case of used ones that I could send you!

But other that little head gasket problem......boost is fun huh?

Later,
Will

 

[Anonymous]

You may also need to consider head studs....and try backing the timing off a little.

what gas do you run?

 

[kirkallen143]

What a great post. Really sounds like a fun vehicle. Painted a terrific mental picture.

Hey, if it is the head gasket, how long did you leave it before the next step of torque, each time?

Also, there is another trick used with some alloy motors that may work in your case. After 40-60 minutes run time on a new gasket, you let the engine cool to just warmer than tepid, and retorque the head bolts.

Looking forward to both the post-mortem and next run!

Regards, Adam.

I waited 24 hours before the final torque of 70ftlbs, and like Will says, he's blown 2, and on #6.
Yeah I cannot wait either, I started off easy and I know if/when I get a good hard full throttle start, this turbo engine is going to lift the front tires on take-off. It is alot of torque that this thing puts out.

Kirk
ps. just rolling into the boost in first gear I almost ended up in the ditch, and 3 times. Have to learn how to drive again.

 

[kirkallen143]

Kirk,
Ya give Mike a call and get the Corteco gasket. We're going to put one on in a week or so.
We popped two Fel-pros so far. The Corteco folks said that we shouldn't be able to blow their gasket. (although I'll believe that when I see it!)

BTW the cyl. that blew on Kelly's car was #6....both times. By the looks of our #6 piston we're definately running lean on that one. Probably the same problem you're having.
#6 is notably hotter that the other holes due to it's location. So you might want to try and put an REALLY cold plug in just #6. Might want to try using the Autolite AR33 plugs. If you need a couple to try, I've got about a case of used ones that I could send you!

But other that little head gasket problem......boost is fun huh?

Later,
Will

You know that is a good idea, just replace the #6 with the colder plug, and I can get the AR33's down here, I sure do appreciate it though.
I will order one of those gaskets from Mike and give it a try.
And you bet your buttons, it's fun...it's an addiction!

Kirk

 

[kirkallen143]

You may also need to consider head studs....and try backing the timing off a little.

what gas do you run?

How did you know where I was going, yes the head studs are next. I'll back it down to 15* initial or so, it's at 18* now. I,m running the good ol run of the mill 93 octane from the Exxon up the road from me. A lot of the college folks in their hot sports cars use it here, so they don't let it sit too long in the tanks in the ground.

Kirk

 

[Anonymous]

How did you know where I was going, yes the head studs are next.

The one stud all the way in front, on the pass side will thread down far enough to hit the blades on the water pump!!!

I couldn't figure out how my water pump froze up so fast!

I Used teflon thread liquid sealant from permatex (Napa)

 

[kirkallen143]

Ok,
Some pics of the head and block:



This is #6 w/ gasket in place.


Here is the block w/ gasket in place.


And then just a close up of #6 cylinder in block.

I really cannot see any "blown" distinctions w/ gasket and engine head/block, but it was only a slight bit of oil on the plug, so I guess that all it takes while under pressure.

Kirk
ps. I did here of using a steel shim gasket and coating both sides w/ silver paint and then to torque the hell out of it for a turbo application, anybody?

 

[Anonymous]

I thought I just blew a gasket, too.......
until I tore it down and saw broken ring lands!

My #6 was really oily also, but that piston was still intact.

 

[kirkallen143]

I thought I just blew a gasket, too.......
until I tore it down and saw broken ring lands!

My #6 was really oily also, but that piston was still intact.

Wouldn't I see some scaring on the cylinder walls? They still have a nice smooth surface, maybe they (the ring lands) are in the pan. I am going to change back to regular Shell Rotella instead of the synthetic they offer. That synthetic finds even the smallest of pin holes, and I need to change the oil anyways, it is already discolored with sludge and engine assembly lube (I forgot about the lube and thought I had water in the oil, thinking to myself why is it stripped on the dipstick and not milky).

Kirk

 

[Anonymous]

Wouldn't I see some scoring on the cylinder walls?

I never had any scoring on those two cyls

I am going to change back to regular Shell Rotella instead of the synthetic they offer.

No need for syn.
Semi engines can run 2,000,000 miles on regular Rotella.

 

[Anonymous]

Oh yeah, after engine is all together BUT NOT FIRED, do a compression check.

 

[kirkallen143]

Oh yeah, after engine is all together BUT NOT FIRED, do a compression check.

Vatozone free loaner tool time. Ordered what I need from Mike, should be here next week, maybe sooner.

Kirk

 

[kirkallen143]

Why does work have to start picking up when you have more important projects at home, like turbos?!!?? Got the new head gasket installed Friday evening (looked like it had white latex paint sprayed all over it) with the new head studs and I get the AR-33's today, gettin' there.
I plan on the final torque procedure to let the engine run alittle, then retorque, reduce the timing, and ease into the boost this time so the engine can break-in some. Sure will be hard, though... you know that BOOST is addicting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kirk
ps. I'm almost "back in the saddle again".

 

[kirkallen143]

... you know that BOOST is addicting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kirk
ps. I'm almost "back in the saddle again".

Did I say "almost" in the saddle? Well did a compression check...
#6-- 160 psi
#5-- 45 psi (90 psi w/ wet test)
#4-- 120 psi
#3-- 80 psi
#2-- 30 psi (85 w/ wet test)
#1-- 125 psi

Well, looks like it is time to build up a block. I really don't want to buy a short block that has been put together in an assembly line from someone making $5.00 an hour, so i intend to use the one I have (hopefully it is rebuildable).

I am going to have this one balanced, so a remanufactured short block would have to be disassembled anyways for this.

What was a safe over bore for the cylinders (this will be turbo'ed)?

I plan on decking the block enough to true things up and not to raise compression up too much (this will solve some of the issues if the block is warped, because my head has already been milled 0.025")

Will use ARP fasteners on the bottom side (crank and rods)

Keeping the stock cam and hydraulic lifters are new.

Might as well do it right, this is my plan.

Anything I forgot?

Kirk
ps. Thank God for IRS refunds!

 

[Anonymous]

I'm glad you did do a compression check before you got too far into putting it back together.

But I am sad you hurt the pistons/rings. Detonation sucks.

If you had another spare 200 you could just swap motors when you hurt one!

 

[Anonymous]

Boost is addictive and Wow is it fun when it's boosting.

Boost is also deadly.

I really enjoy reading your post', keep us up-to-date with your progress.

May your next build be indestructable.

Bob

 

[kirkallen143]

I really enjoy reading your post', keep us up-to-date with your progress.

May your next build be indestructable.

Bob

I shall do sir, as always someone needs to learn from my mistakes. This was a block from a '68 Falcon (C8**) they had put into this bronco of mine, and no telling how many miles were on it then. Have a good one.

Kirk

 

[kirkallen143]

OK,

The machinist just called this afternoon...0.028" wear on the cylinder walls, so we are headed for a 0.040" overbore w/ oversized chromoly (?) rings. I told him this was a turbo application and made a suggestion about using the cast pistons. Told him about folks here running up to 22psi w/ them, but he kept pushing for forged.
I asked earlier in the small six section about ARPs on the rods ('cause at Mike's FSPP order site they say you have to machine the rod for them), yet someone on the forum told me they would go in with no maching. Has anyone done this already, the 289/302 SBF ARP rod studs/bolts to the 200 inline 6? I ordered the ARP main studs already from Mike and would really like the ones for the rods, too. The machinist will also deck the top of the block 0.010", balance the whole system (flywheel and harmonic balancer inc.), and do some grinding on the crank. Basically a rebuild done right.
Cost...I will let you know, and hopefully I will still have enough to pay attention when it's all over with. I do not have a computer at home so I will have to wait for Monday morning for y'alls replies and thank you for them, too! Appreciate it fellers.

Kirk

 

[Funky Cricket]

forty over is pretty big on these engines if I remember my specs right.
someone much more knowledgable than me can tell ya right though.