68 170 Head rebuild

[ledslinger29]

David,
Maybe someone put a tag from another carb on it, as I do believe I have an SCV on the side.

I sent it to Pony Carbs a long time ago to have it gone through, and I sent my distributor to Distributor Dynamics to have the Pertronix installed

Is there an advantage to installing solid lifters on a block that plumbed for hydraulic lifters? Is there something I can look for in the lifter hole to be sure?
Do you still recommend using 144 intake valves for exhaust on a 170? I'm having to replace all the valves anyhow...

 

[CZLN6]

Howdy:

That is definitely a pre-'68 1100. The SCV is a dead give-away. You need to check your distributor to verify that it is a '68 with both vacuum and centrifugal advance. The card you photographed refers to a Load-O-Matic and the graph refers to vacuum advance only. If that's the case, too bad. But, a well tuned Load-O-Matic system with a PetronX and a pre-'68 carb is not all that bad. The Pre-'68 1100s for a 200 engine are rated at 185 cfm as compared to the 1100 on a 170 at 156 cfm. So that may be an opportunity for a performance upgrade. The LoM distributor will create another problem when you decide to go to a two barrel carb.

In cars the change away from the LOM system took place after the 1967 model year. Broncos may have been different.

Did you tell your machinist to include a back cut on the Intake valves? On the 144 intakes as exhaust, no. 1.5" exhaust valves are easily available now. Check with Matt Cox at Vintage Inlines.

On the lifters, you can use solid lifters in a hydraulic block but about all you'd gain is the need to adjust the valves periodically. For your use solid lifters offer no advantage.

Enjoy the journey.

Adios, David

 

[ledslinger29]

Thanks David for the insight. Should I get rid of the solid lifters and go to hydraulic? I definitely intend to follow your suggestion for the back cut on the intake valves when I give the machinist the green light again. I believe the cast number on the distributor starts with C5

 

[CZLN6]

Howdy Back:

While you're checking stuff measure the diameter of the carb in the photo. The 1101 was first used on Ford cars that had a 223 six. That version had a SCV and would be compatible with a LoM distributor. All 1100 carbs had a throttle bore of 1 7/16" while all 1101s had a T-bore of 1 11/16".

Sorry, I should have remembered that earlier.

Are you sure you have solid lifters?

Adios, David

 

[ledslinger29]

I definitely have solid lifters. Carb bore is very nearly 1.5"....

 

[ledslinger29]

I got the port divider, and dropped it off at the machine shop to have it welded in just in case I go to headers later.
The handbook notes that increasing my exhaust valve size to 1.468 is a worthwhile change to make. The machinist noted that if i went with oversize exhaust valves I might need some shrouding, I'm not sure if it's worth it for that.
If i WERE to put a different cam in, say a 260H, would I lose much bottom end torque? I have so many questions. Fortunately, Im in no rush, and the machine shop has been helpful thus far.

 

[chad]

'...the machine shop has been helpful thus far."
sometimes good, sometimes bad. "Good' if e knows these motors well. Many don't.
Anyway, deffinatly modernize the cam.
BUT
(with this whole build) dial in the exact application for end use. I believe U to have more exper. in rebuilds (earlier comment) so this may B a moot point.
If you cont. as U R w/a good deal of research B4 the build & decide on your use (80% of the time's RPMs) select a cam for that, build the engine around THAT. Hold to the vision (app) till the end with out any changes and you will have a great purpose built vehicle. Seen 2 many hack jobs due to changes, new ideas, add-ons, etc. It is more importantly so w/a multi-purpose rig like a bronk!
Applications:
mall crawl, DD, (even some st/strip - a bronk? sadly, Yes), mudder, lght off rd, rock crawler, wrk trk (mine for 30 yrs, soon to B DD) etc, etc…
I like the falcon 6 for it's low rev tq.

 

[ledslinger29]

This will be mostly on the road use, with a little bit of woods and mud in the mix. Pulling a jonbote now and again. My deer lease is an hour away, and it has good roads now. I used to do some heavy mudding with this little truck, but I don't have time to fix all the things I break in the mud anymore. I still get the itch occasionally though.

 

[chad]

"...mostly on the road use, with a little bit of woods and mud…"
seems like what they were built 4 oem!

mine's goin frm 70% off rd to 30% off rd - a bit of a change but gettin it ready for the daughter.

Yeah, when 1st made folks drove frm home up to a hunt camp or similar venue, got out'n switched the hubs, drove another few mi into a sight.
In the '90s they started REALLY modin them. Chuck Atkins ( or another - K bar S) & others had been doin so 4 yrs but the growth of da net really kicked it off.

 

[ledslinger29]

So this is one of the lifter bores in my block. It came (to me) with solid lifters, the block casting indicates it is a 68. The hole right off the tip of the finger, in the side of the lifter bore, is a little hard to see, is how I assume oil gets to the lifter. Am I right? What is the difference between this and a block made for hydraulic lifters?

 

[CZLN6]

Howdy again:

Hummmm, .060" over bore.... Hummm. If it is a 68 block casting I'm 99% sure that it came from Dearborn with hydraulic lifers. Can you find the previous owner to find out the history of the engine? Yes, oil flows down the pushrods to the lifters and cam. Other than that there may be some internal changes to the block from solid to hydraulic lifters.

Can you verify if the cam is stock or an upgrade?

Very interesting, keep the clues to this mystery coming.

Adios, David

 

[ledslinger29]

I had another guy say that the 170 they put in the trucks stayed with solid lifters, never went hydraulic. That's not to say that this thing hasn't already been gone through. I bought the truck about 10 years ago, no idea where the previous owner is now. I do know that there were three different types of lifter rods in it, which indicates to me that somebody new the valves and seats needed some love. Im not sure if the cam is stock or not, I'm getting more and more curious as to what Im actually dealing with here. Im pulling the block out of the truck this weekend. That way I can check the chain and the cam.
EDIT: Head appears to be from a 69 Falcon, if I decoded the cast no. correctly.

 

[chad]

"...Head appears to be from a 69 Falcon, if I decoded>"
i don't believe U can pinpoint any model. U may have a nice head 4 the 2v mill/mount.
Does it have an < M > in the casting?

 

[ledslinger29]

nope. Number is c9de6090j. Guides I saw saw said it was designed for a 69 falcon, with the d indicating the car family, but that could be bunk. All I know is what the interwebs and the handbook tell me. Either way the head is newer than the rest of the truck

 

[chad]

Now 4 da block'n exh #s if U wanna know bout them as well…
40+ yrs can mean anything in mix'n match I6s.
C9DE-6090 - J (with an M after it, @ the < J >) is a nice 1 yr head that many mill flat @ the carb hole 4 good 2v swap-in.
Has better runnerscast. There's sm log, big log hex, flat. Flat is the M head I believe. Many other heads milled
look pretty bad. I think for the 2v - adding stock to the non M is a first step B4 milling that adds to the success of
placing a Weber 32/36, 38/38 or other tuneable carb for pep & HP. (not necessarily sought in a bronk).

Good Luck! Keep talkin...

 

[ledslinger29]

Number on the block is c8de6016a, which, I believe also indicates it was designed to go in a falcon, so maybe the block IS hydraulic lifter/cam ready.

 

[ledslinger29]

Is that a reman tag between the freeze plugs?

 

[chad]

I can't C it but I call that area the "block code". It's a raised part of the cast (My 170: C8DE, 6015 - ?? in two lines of letters/numbers).
Yours DOES have the bronk pan - mine has a dip stick on each side! Some 1 put a car motor in my rig but kept the bronk pan (& this wuz pre '83 when I acquired it)…

Oh, wait, on 2nd glance I C the tag U mean.
Not on my motor or any of the other 2 (250s).

 

[bubba22349]

Number on the block is c8de6016a, which, I believe also indicates it was designed to go in a falcon, so maybe the block IS hydraulic lifter/cam ready.

A 1968 block should be a drilled for Hydraulic Lifters to verify this you can pull one lifter and look. If the lifter bore is drilled then it can use Hydrolic lifters. Good luck

 

[ledslinger29]

How much play should I have in my