Weber 32/36 ?
- Thread starter stanyon
- Start date
Check this Stickie:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=54798
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=54798
The stickie is a GREAT link I had missed it.
Havent run a 5200 weber in over 30 years but looked in my notes to see what I had back then.
These are all on the 122cid Pinto 4cyl but maybe helpful.
Message is the stock carbs are too lean in the secondary especially.
No O2 meters back then, just a stopwatch and open road for the most part.
Also one of those WAY cool MPG meters, wish they still made those things!!!
All these started with the 26-27 venturi 32-36 throttle carb.
CAR #1
Stock 73 Pinto c4, girlfriends car
Jets 132-135, Bleeds 180-150
I think this was factory stock, no reason to doubt it
22.1 at 64mph in the 1/4 mile, SMOKIN hot. ROTFLMAO.
Changed to
Jets 132-160, Bleeds 180-180
21.6 at 66mph, felt like a pro-stocker compared to before. Well ok it was less of a dawg.
Car #2
72 Pinto 4spd, headers (my car)
Stock 26-27 and 32-36 carb liked:
Jets 132-160
Bleeds 195-180 for best MPG or 160-180 for best acceleration
Added the Ford "X" cam and played with uncorking the headers. Shifted at 7000.
Secondary venturi was then punched out as noted in the stickie so this carb was
26-31 venturi, 32-36 throttle
Lots of stopwatch testing, ran best with
Jets 140-200 open headers, 132-200 closed headers
Bleeds 190-195
With the closed header jetting it would get 33-35mpg. I had no trouble disposing of the BMW's and 924 Porches of the day.
Cam and headers (especially open) will affect the jetting any carb wants.
I never messed with the idle jets.
Hope this is helpful as a start.
Havent run a 5200 weber in over 30 years but looked in my notes to see what I had back then.
These are all on the 122cid Pinto 4cyl but maybe helpful.
Message is the stock carbs are too lean in the secondary especially.
No O2 meters back then, just a stopwatch and open road for the most part.
Also one of those WAY cool MPG meters, wish they still made those things!!!
All these started with the 26-27 venturi 32-36 throttle carb.
CAR #1
Stock 73 Pinto c4, girlfriends car
Jets 132-135, Bleeds 180-150
I think this was factory stock, no reason to doubt it
22.1 at 64mph in the 1/4 mile, SMOKIN hot. ROTFLMAO.
Changed to
Jets 132-160, Bleeds 180-180
21.6 at 66mph, felt like a pro-stocker compared to before. Well ok it was less of a dawg.
Car #2
72 Pinto 4spd, headers (my car)
Stock 26-27 and 32-36 carb liked:
Jets 132-160
Bleeds 195-180 for best MPG or 160-180 for best acceleration
Added the Ford "X" cam and played with uncorking the headers. Shifted at 7000.
Secondary venturi was then punched out as noted in the stickie so this carb was
26-31 venturi, 32-36 throttle
Lots of stopwatch testing, ran best with
Jets 140-200 open headers, 132-200 closed headers
Bleeds 190-195
With the closed header jetting it would get 33-35mpg. I had no trouble disposing of the BMW's and 924 Porches of the day.
Cam and headers (especially open) will affect the jetting any carb wants.
I never messed with the idle jets.
Hope this is helpful as a start.
For a few provisos and some dollars, you could set up a Tripminder mpg meter and use a cell phone app, and test an tune your Weber 32/36 with safety on the road.
The Weber 32/36 just needs its float level and emulsion tube and jetting optimized, and it'll then work on just about anything low powered enough. The fact that its a mirror image of the US Holley Weber and Carter Weber carb messes people up, as do the jetting call sizes and some really odd fuel return line and throttle lever variances. After that, you can start playing with them, and your able to make them flow over what a 350 cfm Holley 2-bbl carb can make. Emissions wise, the carb was always a little bit hard to manage, all Webers aren't as easy to tune to get a good idle CO figures, and can run rich if the right approaches to calibration aren't taken. A proper US made 2-bbl 2300 Holley or 2100 Autolite or 2150 Motorcraft or Rochester 2CG are simpler devices which are less mysterious, as they don't have a tailored emulsion tube and air corrector stuff, they just use Power valve channel restrictions and power valves and stone age simple venturi variations to suit big capacity application. But Chevy had to ditch the bigger Rochesters and use a Holley Weber 5200 seies version of the 32/36...because the carb is the easiest to calibrate for a smaller 2.3 four. A similar Weber 32/36 is totally adjustable, and its multiple swaps, multiple venturi and cfm size status, from 60 hp 1.2 liter Datsun 210's to 170 hp 4.2 liter Jeeps and 4.9 F150's make it very hard to find a one size fits all calibration. It's even got a Ca CARB and EO status as a BMW2002 Solex carb replacement, but Solex's are even harder to calibrate than Webers, so that's no supprise...
They do, but like ADI water/methonal injection,and high compression ratios on non turbo engines, the Malaise area Tripminder MPG meters have had to move on up to OBDI. OBDII, and CFI/EFI logic. Since cheap oil made congress go soft on CAFE fuel economy from 1984 onward to date, the only options for carb guys are 30 dollar flow meters, and a pulse hookup to on some old 1981 to 1992 Fox or 1981 to 1989 Panther platforms, or some specific GM cars. They were clock interface devices, and worked exceptionally well. My friends 1982 Commodore SLE 3.3 had one, http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/ ... CF0451.jpg. Both Ford and GM used the electronic devices with carb engines using a secondary supplier, it had three lines, in and out and a tank return line or activated carbon arrester vapor line equipped fuel flow meter, and the fuel flow meter is still around as an old part on theses junked Panther, Fox and B body gm letter cars. It was most common in the US as a E69Z-10D924-B Flow Sensor service replacement in Aerostar automatic 2.8's. The 150 to 160 hp versions of the Bosch K Jetronic 2.8 Injection on 1981 to 1985 Euro Fords is the same, but listed as 61044440-1 in http://www.motomobil.com/3237,61044440-1.html
See http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread. ... rated-merc on what the Fuel Flow Meter/Separator/Reg.Valve sensor is. It's used all over the world from European and South African P100 Pickups too, and is available as item 6097149 and 6161181 for the Fuel Flow Meter Assembly on http://eucatparts.com/?action=cat_ford_ ... d_model=73
If you use the common 1981 to 1989 non CFI/EFI carb engines three line fuel flow meter from Ford or GM, you'll be able to replace the Pin 34 from an EECIV appliaction to run any Tripminder this way http://www.therangerstation.com/Magazin ... minder.htm
If you use an EECIV, the box code calibrates the Pin 34 out put to suit the injection type, injector type in pounds per hour, and if you mess with it, you then sclae your mpg up or down, because the Pin 34 out put is just the nuber of activated pulse widths based on the factory injector for the engine. For example.
Various Fox 81-82 Tbirds, 83-85 LTDS and 81-82 Cougars, 82-92 Fox Lincolns along with all 81-89 Crown Victorias, Mercury Grand Marquis had them as an option. Then in the Noughties, the Explorer started running vehicle information centers, but the idea failed to impact anyone.
The ScanGauge II trip computers for OBDII cars are easy and cheap to get from the ecomodder site, while the mpginea is a good step up from the essentially carb based Ford Tripminder for pre OBDI cars.
1981-1987 GM-Holden http://www.hh.hansenits.com/model/v/vh_ ... puter.html
1981-1985 XT5 GM Holden Commodore Trip minder Fuel flow meter http://www.hh.hansenits.com/assets/vh-f ... g12-14.gif
Carb, CFI, or EFI 1981-1992 Fox/1981-1989 Panther
The EECIV has a pin set aside to emulate a carb fuel flow meter.
The Weber 32/36 just needs its float level and emulsion tube and jetting optimized, and it'll then work on just about anything low powered enough. The fact that its a mirror image of the US Holley Weber and Carter Weber carb messes people up, as do the jetting call sizes and some really odd fuel return line and throttle lever variances. After that, you can start playing with them, and your able to make them flow over what a 350 cfm Holley 2-bbl carb can make. Emissions wise, the carb was always a little bit hard to manage, all Webers aren't as easy to tune to get a good idle CO figures, and can run rich if the right approaches to calibration aren't taken. A proper US made 2-bbl 2300 Holley or 2100 Autolite or 2150 Motorcraft or Rochester 2CG are simpler devices which are less mysterious, as they don't have a tailored emulsion tube and air corrector stuff, they just use Power valve channel restrictions and power valves and stone age simple venturi variations to suit big capacity application. But Chevy had to ditch the bigger Rochesters and use a Holley Weber 5200 seies version of the 32/36...because the carb is the easiest to calibrate for a smaller 2.3 four. A similar Weber 32/36 is totally adjustable, and its multiple swaps, multiple venturi and cfm size status, from 60 hp 1.2 liter Datsun 210's to 170 hp 4.2 liter Jeeps and 4.9 F150's make it very hard to find a one size fits all calibration. It's even got a Ca CARB and EO status as a BMW2002 Solex carb replacement, but Solex's are even harder to calibrate than Webers, so that's no supprise...
WerbyFord":1q8sg3ld said:
They do, but like ADI water/methonal injection,and high compression ratios on non turbo engines, the Malaise area Tripminder MPG meters have had to move on up to OBDI. OBDII, and CFI/EFI logic. Since cheap oil made congress go soft on CAFE fuel economy from 1984 onward to date, the only options for carb guys are 30 dollar flow meters, and a pulse hookup to on some old 1981 to 1992 Fox or 1981 to 1989 Panther platforms, or some specific GM cars. They were clock interface devices, and worked exceptionally well. My friends 1982 Commodore SLE 3.3 had one, http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/ ... CF0451.jpg. Both Ford and GM used the electronic devices with carb engines using a secondary supplier, it had three lines, in and out and a tank return line or activated carbon arrester vapor line equipped fuel flow meter, and the fuel flow meter is still around as an old part on theses junked Panther, Fox and B body gm letter cars. It was most common in the US as a E69Z-10D924-B Flow Sensor service replacement in Aerostar automatic 2.8's. The 150 to 160 hp versions of the Bosch K Jetronic 2.8 Injection on 1981 to 1985 Euro Fords is the same, but listed as 61044440-1 in http://www.motomobil.com/3237,61044440-1.html
See http://www.grandmarq.net/vb/showthread. ... rated-merc on what the Fuel Flow Meter/Separator/Reg.Valve sensor is. It's used all over the world from European and South African P100 Pickups too, and is available as item 6097149 and 6161181 for the Fuel Flow Meter Assembly on http://eucatparts.com/?action=cat_ford_ ... d_model=73
If you use the common 1981 to 1989 non CFI/EFI carb engines three line fuel flow meter from Ford or GM, you'll be able to replace the Pin 34 from an EECIV appliaction to run any Tripminder this way http://www.therangerstation.com/Magazin ... minder.htm
If you use an EECIV, the box code calibrates the Pin 34 out put to suit the injection type, injector type in pounds per hour, and if you mess with it, you then sclae your mpg up or down, because the Pin 34 out put is just the nuber of activated pulse widths based on the factory injector for the engine. For example.
Various Fox 81-82 Tbirds, 83-85 LTDS and 81-82 Cougars, 82-92 Fox Lincolns along with all 81-89 Crown Victorias, Mercury Grand Marquis had them as an option. Then in the Noughties, the Explorer started running vehicle information centers, but the idea failed to impact anyone.
The ScanGauge II trip computers for OBDII cars are easy and cheap to get from the ecomodder site, while the mpginea is a good step up from the essentially carb based Ford Tripminder for pre OBDI cars.
1981-1987 GM-Holden http://www.hh.hansenits.com/model/v/vh_ ... puter.html
1981-1985 XT5 GM Holden Commodore Trip minder Fuel flow meter http://www.hh.hansenits.com/assets/vh-f ... g12-14.gif
Carb, CFI, or EFI 1981-1992 Fox/1981-1989 Panther
The EECIV has a pin set aside to emulate a carb fuel flow meter.
A quick note on setting up instant mpg for a car. This would be an ideal calibration tool for a 32/36. Just an inline VR Fox/Panther electronic speedo link, and some kind of fuel flow meter for a Tripminder, and your dough is bread. It has a fuel regulator, so the fuel pressure can be dialed down.
Sources of the Fuel Flow Meter/Separator/Reg.Valve sensor are many. For instance, the Aussie 81-85 Holden Commodore 4.2 and 5.0 V8 copied the 1981-1982 Ford 4.2, 5.0 and 5.8 set up, so did the Injection UK/GB and German Ford Granada 2.8 V6, the Sierra and P100 pickup etc
http://www.hh.hansenits.com/assets/vh-fuelsensor-v8-fig12-15.gif
Here are some other interchangeability pictures. There's plenty of info, and the Tripminder computer swap is really simple, no matter what the induction system, although for EFI, Ford populates the EEC III and EEC IV computer with the injector pound per hour values, so any changes and tank resistance to stage relationships differences mean you have to shop around for some parts.
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums...orGrandMarquisTripminderComputerschematic.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/1994CrownVicTripminderadditionfrom1992-1.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums...rownVicorGrandMarquisTripminderComputerv2.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/1981to1986CrownVicTripminder.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/PreOBDICV_MGM_FoxfuelflowmeterforTripminder.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/XT5GMHoldenCommodoreTripminderFuelflowmeter.jpg
Sources of the Fuel Flow Meter/Separator/Reg.Valve sensor are many. For instance, the Aussie 81-85 Holden Commodore 4.2 and 5.0 V8 copied the 1981-1982 Ford 4.2, 5.0 and 5.8 set up, so did the Injection UK/GB and German Ford Granada 2.8 V6, the Sierra and P100 pickup etc
http://www.hh.hansenits.com/assets/vh-fuelsensor-v8-fig12-15.gif
Here are some other interchangeability pictures. There's plenty of info, and the Tripminder computer swap is really simple, no matter what the induction system, although for EFI, Ford populates the EEC III and EEC IV computer with the injector pound per hour values, so any changes and tank resistance to stage relationships differences mean you have to shop around for some parts.
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums...orGrandMarquisTripminderComputerschematic.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/1994CrownVicTripminderadditionfrom1992-1.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums...rownVicorGrandMarquisTripminderComputerv2.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/1981to1986CrownVicTripminder.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/PreOBDICV_MGM_FoxfuelflowmeterforTripminder.jpg
http://i1215.photobucket.com/albums/cc501/xecute6/XT5GMHoldenCommodoreTripminderFuelflowmeter.jpg
