All Small Six Back in the Saddle
- Thread starter cr_bobcat
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- boneheaded_ideas
This relates to all small sixes
pic 1 you got 3.120 on my 250 I got 3.146 on 200- 3.140
Pic 2 you got 1.029-------------------1.039...................1.040
Pic 3 you got .585..................................... .576.................. .572 But I meaursed closer to the tip of lobe and it is thinner there.
Pic 4 you got 3.898.................................. 3.910................. 3.880
Pic 5 you got 1.810 .................................. 1.810 ................. 1.785
Bottom line on 250 I think HaHa what I got on first four lobes .046-.039-.044-.046 ---200 first 3 .022-.018-.023 offset to the rear. on the 200 seams like something is off, maybe my head.
Best would be to get the lifter bore centers drawing from Ford and compare
Pic 2 you got 1.029-------------------1.039...................1.040
Pic 3 you got .585..................................... .576.................. .572 But I meaursed closer to the tip of lobe and it is thinner there.
Pic 4 you got 3.898.................................. 3.910................. 3.880
Pic 5 you got 1.810 .................................. 1.810 ................. 1.785
Bottom line on 250 I think HaHa what I got on first four lobes .046-.039-.044-.046 ---200 first 3 .022-.018-.023 offset to the rear. on the 200 seams like something is off, maybe my head.
Best would be to get the lifter bore centers drawing from Ford and compare
With out a lot of grinding I do not think that the 300 lifters will work. a shorter link height connection and the lifter body cut away and only a tower like support for the link connect button, morel and Bam has some like that and not the full round upper body that the 300 ones do. Less button stick out away from lifter would also help.
Keep in mind that the 200 needs rod clearance notches that the stock 250 cams do not have. Most after market cam makers use the notched 200 cams for the 250.
I also could have bumped on my way out too. I tried to be careful but you know how it is! Normally I would measure 3 times and throw out the outlier LoL
I had to do some grinding to make them fit for the 250. I actually had less of a problem getting them into the one slot that I tried on the 200. If I get time, I will attempt to grind out the end holes to make it work. It's mostly a matter of time. I'll focus on getting into the ends and take some before/after of how much I have to hog out.
First I would try to get the lifter into its bore on one of the double wide spots first. Because the 200 block lifter area is so much shorter, I think the tall roller lifters will hit the outside of the top of block a lot before it lines up with the lifter bore and slide in. If you look it the end opening they are closer to the outside edge of the block which is good. Time will tell
If it was me, I would concentrate on the availability of a roller camshaft, i would say this will be more difficult than getting lifters to fit. Argentina?
The availability of a small block six roller camshaft depends on the volume.
There are more 200s than 250s here in the states making the 200 six the key to availability.
It is important to know if the same tie bar roller lifters can be installed in the 200 six before a run of 25 roller camshafts would be considered.
The 240/300 six roller cams are done in runs of 25 pieces, but we knew there were high numbers.
However, the original poster of this thread was just performing this exercise out of curiosity.
I would be the one that would push the possibility of making it happen and I need to have the 200 six included for the numbers.
By the way, AFAIK cr-bobcat is the first person to install a hydraulic roller lifter in a small block six and it was done without major block modifications.
That says something!
I hopefully will have some time to make grindy noises on that spare 200 block soon. It's a full short block so I should be able to just grind and drop in. I honestly don't think it's going to be any harder to do than the 250 was. There looks to be enough meat on the deck for me to hog that hole out without coming close to the water or cylinder.
You can see what I had to do here on the 250. Notice I did it without boogering up the deck. I used a mini belt sander and went straight vertical. I obviously haven't tried to make it look pretty and smooth things out but the proof of concept is there.
I know this getting the cart ahead of the horse, but there was talk of making the snout like the SBF V8 because there has been issues on 250 and shearing the locating/drive pin. It would give the 250 a roller chain with the ability to degree. But now the 200 has a indexable roller timing set available already. I have never saw a 200 that was properly assembled that has had and an issue.
AK Miller told me that the thinner silent stock type 250 chains had less problem than the wider ones. That makes me think that a the lighter roller chain would give the stock snout and pin a chance. Also the V8 sprocket does not use the cam spacer it is machined into the sprocket which would give a better connection to the cam when torqued. The V8 cam snout is smaller than the 200/250 and uses a 3/8 retaining bolt, the 200/250 uses a 7/16'' bolt.
What I am saying in my opinion is make the roller cam with a stock snout but add second pin spot 180 out or whatever is deemed best, then the 200 guys that do not need it can leave it out. And for the super high performance 250 guys they can mod the V8 smaller snout sprocket to fit and add a second keyway if they chose and other things if needed.
AK Miller told me that the thinner silent stock type 250 chains had less problem than the wider ones. That makes me think that a the lighter roller chain would give the stock snout and pin a chance. Also the V8 sprocket does not use the cam spacer it is machined into the sprocket which would give a better connection to the cam when torqued. The V8 cam snout is smaller than the 200/250 and uses a 3/8 retaining bolt, the 200/250 uses a 7/16'' bolt.
What I am saying in my opinion is make the roller cam with a stock snout but add second pin spot 180 out or whatever is deemed best, then the 200 guys that do not need it can leave it out. And for the super high performance 250 guys they can mod the V8 smaller snout sprocket to fit and add a second keyway if they chose and other things if needed.
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Certainly in Australian 250s it does. The 250 has the biggest clearance cut outs of any of the cams. most cams available here have the 250 style cut outs.
AFAIK the cams sold today are intended to be interchangeable between all small six blocks. I at least have not read anything that there were special cams for the 250 vs the 144/170/200, but that doesn't mean it didn't happen. Maybe if it's an OEM 250 cam being thrown into a 200? I have no idea what cam was in this block. I can compare it to the old one out of my 200 if I still have it around somewhere. I guess I also have the one inside the spare block, but again, I have no clue as to whether or not it's stock or aftermarket...
No, none that I have seen. When US Ford made the 250 they moved the cam far enough to not need them.
Aftermarket cams usually have their name and part # on end of cam.
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